Your best tips for somewhat newbie racers

[wolcoma]

Great post and anything to promote ski racing in the United States is a good thing. In my case I never became an "elite FIS racer" but there is no doubt ski racing has dramatically improved my overall skiing and enjoyment of the sport.

In terms of equipment, if you don't like tuning than let the shops tune the race skis for you. My two daughters raced in college but they hated tuning race skis, so I made an arrangement with the local ski shop to tune their race skis every week. With tough academics, training, and traveling to races it was well worth the expense.

My one suggestion for all racers is to spend at least 50% of your free skiing on your GS skis. Many racers only free ski on their slalom skis or other shaped skis, but you really want to get the feeling of carving those straighter GS skis in all types of snow conditions and even turn shapes. The good news is GS skis can be a lot of fun to free ski if you have them dialed.

 

[Swede]

Leave the skis to someone (reliable shop) who wax and sharpen once a week, then get a diamond stone and smoothen the edges in between. Wax is to keep bases fresh and your skis to last. Not critical as a competitive component in alpine tech skiing, not even on the WC.
Get a pair of properly fitted race boots. If you like Nordica, Dobermans come well reccomended. A good boot.

 

[Tony S]

I don't have anything novel to add, but I'm posting because there is so much weight here on tuning and tactics, and I want to try to counterbalance that.

Those things are important. I don't want to imply that they're not. However, in my amateur race experience the primary obstacle to fast times among 90% of racers is basic inability to make clean carved turns of varying radii at will. All the other stuff pales by comparison. Therefore I urge the OP to go back and re-read Rudi's first post.

3.Make mistakes on the same course. If you have an hour or two training on the same course, specifically try different things. Go too straight, take risks, and be ok with skiing out or not making a gate. In order to ski faster, you need to ski faster. So go faster without fear of skiing out, and refine your technique and lines untill you fine that ballance between skiing as fast as you can, and skiing out. NOTE- don't simply ski out cause you got late In a turn, you should be skiing as fast as possible and be doing everything in your power to still make it down. To many racers just ski out the first turn they get back or late on.

Don't know about the OP's situation, but my beer league experiences, unfortunately, were that it was all performance and no rehearsal. There was no practice to speak of. The course went up, no pre-runs allowed, the race happened, and then the course came down. Bing bang boom. Course workers had lots of other jobs to finish. After the race the mountain couldn't spare them to monitor for safety and repair the course when gates got messed up or whatever. Additionally management wanted the trail acreage back for general use.

 

[Wilhelmson]

I don't have anything novel to add, but I'm posting because there is so much weight here on tuning and tactics, and I want to try to counterbalance that.

Those things are important. I don't want to imply that they're not. However, in my amateur race experience the primary obstacle to fast times among 90% of racers is basic inability to make clean carved turns of varying radii at will. All the other stuff pales by comparison. Therefore I urge the OP to go back and re-read Rudi's first post.


Don't know about the OP's situation, but my beer league experiences, unfortunately, were that it was all performance and no rehearsal. There was no practice to speak of. The course went up, no pre-runs allowed, the race happened, and then the course came down. Bing bang boom. Course workers had lots of other jobs to finish. After the race the mountain couldn't spare them to monitor for safety and repair the course when gates got messed up or whatever. Additionally management wanted the trail acreage back for general use.

I’ve considered the same. If they can build parks and giant jumps for the masses, why not put some gates up for kids and young at heart?

 

[BLiP]

why not put some gates up for kids and young at heart?

Gates take a lot of maintenance. Let the public run through a course and it will be rutted out and look like the Alta snake within an couple of hours. On top of the fact that gates get knocked out and need to be replaced fairly regularly. And maybe liability, but I don't think gates are any more dangerous than a terrain park.

 

[Wilhelmson]

I get it but the race teams shred the courses day in day out and the resort just makes more snow and grooms it up again. Poles getting knocked out seems like a more difficult issue but still very manageable. If promoting the fun and sport were a priority, it could be done. Toilets get cleaned and the bar stays staffed and the parking guys keep people out of the premium spots, coffee gets made, lifts tended to.

 

[deadheadskier]

The comment on beer league is accurate. No practice runs. Two courses, one run each and done.

I'm fortunate that I live an hour from Gunstock and me and my 8 and 5 year old are there every Sunday. They have a great NASTAR trail that's open every weekend and holiday weeks. $75 for a season pass for it. I have the kids in group programs for two hours at the same time on Sunday, so that frees me up to take 5-7 runs down the course depending on lift lines.

Beyond that I'm doing the Masters GS camp at Mt Snow this Wednesday. Then maybe later in the season I can get to one of the two hour clinics Masters puts on at Cannon every Saturday. They alternate weeks between SL and GS. We also have Indy Passes that we use on Saturdays and Cannon is on that pass.

 

[Primoz]

@nnowak exactly! For SL and GS, don't bother with wax. I mean yes of course wax skis, but forget complicating things with 100 different waxes, overlays and stuff. Something like basic Swix PS7 (and PS6 if it gets really cold) is all you need. Half of guy on WC run SL an even GS without overlays, while the other half uses overlays "because it's WC race and you have to have best wax"... even if ski is on edge 99.9% of time.
Edge on the other side are way more important, and as @nnowak wrote, most important thing is, they are constant, so everytime you step on skis, you have same feeling. That's probably hard to achieve, if skis are done by different people (and on different machines). I'm sure you are busy, but lets be honest... getting edges ready for single pair is 10min work, probably less. Waxing is another 10min (with 1-2h wait in between where you can do anything else). I'm not buying this that in week, someone can't find 20min free time to do this.

 

[deadheadskier]

No offense, but you don't have to "buy" that I don't have the time. I'm not trying to sell my personal realities to you or anyone else. It's not time I'm willing to spend from buying the work bench, vices and tools to doing the actual work. I was pretty clear about this, yet I'm repeatedly being provided with advice / instructions I wasn't inquiring about and borderline being scolded for not agreeing to do it.

Maybe in the future when I'm not consumed with childcare when I'm not on the road 125 nights a year away from them, then maybe I'll start doing some of my own tuning. But definitely not this season or probably any in the near future.

If there isn't simple stuff others do pre race that's totally fine. As a TOTAL novice (again only racing experience prior to this beer league thing was 4 weeks in HS in 1993) I wasn't sure if there were some products and simple techniques people use pulling the race skis out of the car on race nights.
Sounds like their isn't outside of maybe purchasing a diamond stone to touch up edges and then to also drying the skis after the race. Those two things I can and would do.

Anyone have a diamond stone they're particularly fond of?

 

[Scruffy]

Deadhead,

You can do this at your car. Before or After each race night to keep your edges sharp between tunes.

Just get an 87 file guild:

Get two or three grits of Moonflex diamond stones: Red is 200 grit. Yellow is 400. You'll use these the most. Black is 100, and is good if you hit a rock.

Get a spring clamp at a hardware store.
Get some heavy ass rubbers bands to secure the ski brakes in the retracted position.
Get a Swix X-Hard Gummi Stone to remove micro burr after diamond stones.
Literally a couple of passes with the 200, then 400, then one light free hand gummi to remove burr.
Get a fellow beer league racer to give you a quick tutorial, or see internet vids.
Biggest thing to worry about is slipping with the edge guide and rounding your edge, so need a good spot at your car to set and steady the ski. Keep steady and firm pressure against file guide so it doesn't slip. A couple a minutes on each ski after skiing should help you out.

Moonflex Diamond Stones for Edge Tuning (100mm)

Moonflex diamond stones are extremely long lasting and smooth cutting stones due to a unique diamond pattern.

www.tognar.com

 

[Swede]

You will need a file, just stones won’t cut it. If you can’t find the time to learn and do it at home, you need a tech. Find a reliable shop with someone who know what they are doing. Pay the man/woman.

 

[deadheadskier]

@Scruffy

Perfect. Thank you very much. Exactly the type of solution I was asking about.

As for the earlier comments that wax doesn't matter much. That I very much disagree with for Beer League. At least Pats peak league. These are short courses that flatten and straighten out half way down. You definitely aren't on edge 90% of the time. Typically you are in your tuck running flat 5-6 gates up from the finish. So, the amount of glide you get at the bottom is quite important. That and getting a fast start are crucial. Not a lot of gates to make up time in the middle making good turns.

 

[Johnny V.]

That and getting a fast start are crucial.

I was going to suggest that, but it sounds like you're well aware. Some of the folks in our league just push out of the start and wait for something to happen rather than going for it.

 

[Zirbl]

I personally wouldn't get lost in watching WC racers, it's essentially a different sport than a nastar race. I would ask a spouse to video the top guys in your race, and video you, and compare the difference.

Is the aim to win at Nastar or to enjoy skiing well?

 

[Tony S]

These are short courses that flatten and straighten out half way down. You definitely aren't on edge 90% of the time. Typically you are in your tuck running flat 5-6 gates up from the finish. So, the amount of glide you get at the bottom is quite important. That and getting a fast start are crucial. Not a lot of gates to make up time in the middle making good turns

Well in that case just gain some weight and your results will improve! LOL.

<drift>
I've seen and skied a couple of courses like that and always think it's kind of too bad that they bother to set up a whole event for adults but then fill it with borderline kiddie content. Maybe now that I'm fat I'd appreciate it more than I did as a stick guy for whom momentum was never a strength.
</drift>

 

[nnowak]

No offense, but you don't have to "buy" that I don't have the time. I'm not trying to sell my personal realities to you or anyone else. It's not time I'm willing to spend from buying the work bench, vices and tools to doing the actual work. I was pretty clear about this, yet I'm repeatedly being provided with advice / instructions I wasn't inquiring about and borderline being scolded for not agreeing to do it.

Maybe in the future when I'm not consumed with childcare when I'm not on the road 125 nights a year away from them, then maybe I'll start doing some of my own tuning. But definitely not this season or probably any in the near future.

If you don't have the minutes available to keep your skis in shape, how do you have the hours available for recreational racing?

If there isn't simple stuff others do pre race that's totally fine. As a TOTAL novice (again only racing experience prior to this beer league thing was 4 weeks in HS in 1993) I wasn't sure if there were some products and simple techniques people use pulling the race skis out of the car on race nights.
Sounds like their isn't outside of maybe purchasing a diamond stone to touch up edges and then to also drying the skis after the race. Those two things I can and would do.

Anyone have a diamond stone they're particularly fond of?

Don't pull your skis out of the back of your car and tune at the race. Tune them at home whenever it is convenient. This could be the day before, or the week before, doesn't matter.

 

[nnowak]

As for the earlier comments that wax doesn't matter much. That I very much disagree with for Beer League. At least Pats peak league. These are short courses that flatten and straighten out half way down. You definitely aren't on edge 90% of the time. Typically you are in your tuck running flat 5-6 gates up from the finish. So, the amount of glide you get at the bottom is quite important. That and getting a fast start are crucial. Not a lot of gates to make up time in the middle making good turns.

Wax is far less important for beer league than on the world cup. You would need to execute every turn to world cup perfection for wax to start having an impact. Even the best world cup athletes do not execute every turn to perfection, they just make the fewest mistakes. If you are butchering your turns, there is no magic wax that will make up for the lost speed. Just because you are in a tuck, it does not mean wax is suddenly more important. Plenty of people still skid turns and lose speed when in a tuck.

 

[deadheadskier]

This message is for several of you. You are obviously very passionate about racing and gear and way more experienced and knowledgeable than I. That's great. But think about context and audience and the actual advisement being requested.

Some of you may not realize this, but you are acting fairly pretentious with your responses and I kind of regret even asking the last minute tuning question. Can we scratch it from the record?

Again, context and audience.

Your audience is a 48 year old guy who started racing at 46. I've skied 40 years and could tell you all you want to know about many free skiing disciplines, I'm just a novice at racing. I'm in a BEER LEAGUE. I'm not aspiring to be a WC skier or even a Masters racing participant. I may when I retire in 15-20 years do Masters if still physically able, but that's not on the menu today.

Context:

So what's the beer league? It's a 9 week season at a 700 vertical hill in New Hampshire. 18 runs down the course for the entire season with 3 free runs warming up. I'll probably miss 3 race nights due to work obligations. So, this is literally 45 runs on the season there. 31,500 vertical feet. I train on a NASTAR course about 8 runs roughly 6 Sundays a season. That's 400 vertical. 19,200 vertical.

So we are talking about 50k worth of vertical on the discipline and these skis. Basically two full ski days as I typically average about 25-30k vert on a free skiing day. I already mentioned I get a professional race tune at the start of the season and again in the middle. $65 a tune. So, I'm basically already investing $65 in tuning a day on this recreational pursuit.

I had seen some fellow beer league racers in the parking lot on occasion spraying their bases and rubbing them with a stone. So, I asked the question here about it. Maybe they're doing something cheap and easy that would be moderately beneficial to my results. That's it.

Are we all on the same page now? Or is one of you gonna insist that I have to buy a Wintersteiger Jupiter for my basement?

 

[Swede]

Perhaps you should ask for advice in the parking lot, and not listen to people here, some with coaching and tech experience from all over the US and Europe all the way up to the WC? I’d say what many on here have said still hold if you want to give yourself a better experience and make the most of your racing. I totally get that it is the absolute lowest rung of ambitions in your beer legue over there, but you need healthy sharp edges. That’s crucial even at U10 level racing.

 

[nnowak]

.I already mentioned I get a professional race tune at the start of the season and again in the middle. $65 a tune. So, I'm basically already investing $65 in tuning a day on this recreational pursuit.

That is roughly what it costs for some basic edge tuning tools.

I had seen some fellow beer league racers in the parking lot on occasion spraying their bases and rubbing them with a stone. So, I asked the question here about it. Maybe they're doing something cheap and easy that would be moderately beneficial to my results. That's it.

It isn't and it won't. Pretty much every liquid topcoat needs a bare minimum of 30 minutes at room temp for all of the solvents to evaporate. Ideally you leave the stuff sit for a few hours and then brush/polish. Applying it in the parking lot right before the race means it will all be worn off before you leave the start. What you were witnessing in the parking lot were some people.with too much disposable income.