Thoughts on the Fischer Vacuum Boots?

[Tricia]

I thought Bluezone had Fischer Vacuum, but if not, give California Ski Company in Berkley a shot.
@Greg Whitehouse is a member here.

 

[KingGrump]

Last question: how were you able to apply different molding pressures for different parts of the boot? Just heat them separately?

The earlier generations of the "vacuum" machine only allows for a single pressure selection. In fact when Fischer initially introduced the boot in fall of 2011, the max pressure was 300. I have no clue what measurement unit the number referred to. During early Dec 2011 Fischer increased the max pressure to 360. It made the boot much nicer. In the Fall of 2014, Fischer introduced a new "vacuum" machine that allows for separate pressure settings for the cuff/rear section and the front of the clog section. Both sections are molded at the same time. One zip up bootie per foot. The max number stayed at 360 for both sections. I can tell from my latest molding that the new 360 pressure that I used for the back section was much higher than the old 360. I lowered the front number to 180 for a bit more comfort but found it was a bit sloppy. I remolded the whole boot using 360 rear/200 front. The boot fits well and is very comfortable. The fit is so nice that I often ski with the boot unbuckled on all terrains and snow conditions. Steep, bumps, trees, groomer, ice, powder and whatever. Many here on the forum often comment on that while we skied together during the gatherings. The fit is really amazing for a one and done fitting.

Caveat: I have had friends that the Vac process just didn't worked for them. Don't know why. Maybe just chemistry.

 

[TheArchitect]

I have a pair of first gen 130 Vacuums and still ski them. I have a love-hate relationship with them but all things considered when I go to buy new boots they'll be on the short list along with maybe a Salomon.

Love:
Best fitting boot I've ever owned
Best performing boot I've ever owned. I truly believe I'm a better skier due to the way the molding process automatically adjusts for forward lean, canting, etc.

Hate:
They are COLD. I've gone through Hotronics, which worked but broke after a couple seasons. I now have Intuition Dreamliners, which help but aren't perfect.
The stock liner was terrible. It was 1st gen so as others have said it's improved.
Heel hold hasn't been great for me but has improved with work by my fitter


The 'Love' list outweighs the 'Hate' list by far for me, especially when you consider there are options to negate the cold.

 

[Pat AKA mustski]

Regarding fitting in the shop: my biggest issues with all my boots have been hotspots on the top of my foot, and (especially) heel lock. I've found it very difficult to get a good idea of how "locked in" my hell is in the shop. In the past, I've needed that sideways resistance of skiings down an actual mountain to see how much play the heel has.

Actually, I have the same issue. The last time I bought boots, he did have the option to lock in and try it. I found that extremely helpful since heel lock is one of my biggest issues. Any you are right, without resistance, that is very hard to evaluate in the shop.

 

[KingGrump]

I've gone through Hotronics, which worked but broke after a couple seasons.

Thread drift:
Most common hotronic issue is defective cable.
Hotronic Heating Elements with Cambrelle Covers and 15 minute per foot will usually resolve the issue.

 

[Monique]

They do not change as much with temperature variations as other boots so mid winter vs spring skiing are more consistent in how the boots flex.

I can vouch for this.

 

[TheArchitect]

Thread drift:
Most common hotronic issue is defective cable.
Hotronic Heating Elements with Cambrelle Covers and 15 minute per foot will usually resolve the issue.

Yeah, the cable was the issue but I also had one of the batteries stop taking a charge. I'm sure it was defective and not an indication of quality but that along with the cables breaking so quickly makes me hesitant to try that system again.

 

[graham418]

I had a pair of RC4 130 a few seasons ago. I thought it was going to be the best boot, but I couldn't get it to fit right , despite multiple sessions and some reheating. It was a nice boot in a lot of ways.. The flex wasn't affected by change in temperature, so it flexed the same at -30 as +10. It was reasonably lightweight. After 1 season the shell cracked, and I replaced them under warranty with some Atomics

 

[PTskier]

For Whistler skiers---Alpine Pro has Fischer boots. I haven't had boot work done there, but this is my favorite ski tune shop; if their boot fitting is as good as their ski work, it'll be great. They're in the Le Chamois building at Upper Village.

 

[azaslavsky]

I had a pair of RC4 130 a few seasons ago. I thought it was going to be the best boot, but I couldn't get it to fit right , despite multiple sessions and some reheating. It was a nice boot in a lot of ways.. The flex wasn't affected by change in temperature, so it flexed the same at -30 as +10. It was reasonably lightweight. After 1 season the shell cracked, and I replaced them under warranty with some Atomics

What exactly about the boot never fit right, and do you remember how many times you reheated it? This is my big worry - the boot doesn't fit, which requires it to be reheated, which compromises the plastic and dramatically shortens the life of the boot.

 

[skibob]

What exactly about the boot never fit right, and do you remember how many times you reheated it? This is my big worry - the boot doesn't fit, which requires it to be reheated, which compromises the plastic and dramatically shortens the life of the boot.

My personal opinion, given the temps and plastics used, is that isn't as much of an issue as it seems. Getting the plastic too thin will lead to cracking. But that is actually hard to do in the areas that stress. Also, I can see the issue of being sure you wait to ski in them. Plastic is rather like concrete. There is "feels firm" and then there is "ready to stand up to abuse" and there is a rather long time between those two points. Concrete can feel set up in a few hours, yet take weeks to be duty ready. These plastics feel firm after 10 minutes. But take hours to be duty ready.

 

[graham418]

What exactly about the boot never fit right, and do you remember how many times you reheated it? This is my big worry - the boot doesn't fit, which requires it to be reheated, which compromises the plastic and dramatically shortens the life of the boot.

I had pain around the end of my 5th metatarsals , possibly boot too narrow, which I thought would be alleviated by the moulding process, and a bone spur on my heel, (haglunds deformity) which may or may not have been exacerbated by the boot fit. Anyways, It was several local punchings, some grinding , and 2 reheats. I may have had such bruising on my foot by then that nothing would help.

They say that you can remould the boot 5 times with no deterioration of the plastic, if that helps. The shell cracking that I experienced was a known defect for that year, not related to any reheating I had done. Fischer , ( and Skiis & Biikes, shout out to Greg Balmer) were very good about a refund.

 

[azaslavsky]

I had pain around the end of my 5th metatarsals , possibly boot too narrow, which I thought would be alleviated by the moulding process, and a bone spur on my heel, (haglunds deformity) which may or may not have been exacerbated by the boot fit. Anyways, It was several local punchings, some grinding , and 2 reheats. I may have had such bruising on my foot by then that nothing would help.

They say that you can remould the boot 5 times with no deterioration of the plastic, if that helps. The shell cracking that I experienced was a known defect for that year, not related to any reheating I had done. Fischer , ( and Skiis & Biikes, shout out to Greg Balmer) were very good about a refund.

Just out of curiosity, what are you skiing in nowadays?

 

[KingGrump]

What exactly about the boot never fit right, and do you remember how many times you reheated it? This is my big worry - the boot doesn't fit, which requires it to be reheated, which compromises the plastic and dramatically shortens the life of the boot.

I do not believe remolding shortens the life of the boot. My son is in the first gen regular white 130. He bought them when he was 17. His feet was still changing every year. He remolded them every year for the first four years. So far, no issues. He is over 200 lbs and a very powerful skier. He boots never cracked.

The fitter should examine your feet and talk to you about known issues with your feet. The additional padding they put on your feet to make room for identified issues during the molding process is key.

 

[graham418]

Just out of curiosity, what are you skiing in nowadays?

Atomic Hawx 2.0 130 . A different feel than I am used to. But no issues.

 

[Monique]

The fitter should examine your feet and talk to you about known issues with your feet.

+1

Again, gotta say, molding is not a cure-all - the boot needs to generally fit your foot well, then you go from there.

I'm having issues with my moldable AT boots, largely my fault. Since my Fischer women's boots fit so well, I just assumed that their unisex AT boots would work well with some molding. It's not clear this is true. (But it's also not clear it's NOT true - my problem may simply be my feet when I put skinning pressure on the ball of my foot for enough time. The boots are comfortable standing around, and when skiing. Just not when skinning.)

 

[MRT]

+1

Again, gotta say, molding is not a cure-all - the boot needs to generally fit your foot well, then you go from there.

I'm having issues with my moldable AT boots, largely my fault. Since my Fischer women's boots fit so well, I just assumed that their unisex AT boots would work well with some molding. It's not clear this is true. (But it's also not clear it's NOT true - my problem may simply be my feet when I put skinning pressure on the ball of my foot for enough time. The boots are comfortable standing around, and when skiing. Just not when skinning.)

Hi Monique,

Which part of the ball of your foot bothers you when you are skinning----top/bottom/side/ahead of the ball or behind?

We sell Fischer---might have some ideas.

Mike
Master Bootfitter/Cped

 

[Monique]

Hi Monique,

Which part of the ball of your foot bothers you when you are skinning----top/bottom/side/ahead of the ball or behind?

We sell Fischer---might have some ideas.

Mike
Master Bootfitter/Cped

Umm, it's been a while, so I have to go from memory .... my fitter is great, but he does not do a lot of work on AT boots (and readily admits as much).

I have the green and white Transalp TS with stock lace-up liners. I don't recall if the liners are moldable - I feel like they are and we did? - but I did the full "Vacuum" (pressure) fit on the shells.

I have tailor's bunions on both feet, and have had surgery for a Morton's neuroma on the left foot, but both feet show signs of it now and then. We've punched out the "sixth toe" area as much as my fitter thinks is reasonable before risking compromise of the tech fitting (although I'm currently using a frame binding).

Anyway, there's pain/numbness that sort of spreads out from the area of the neuromas (between third and fourth toes) so that it's under ball of the foot and *maybe* just a smidge behind, going across from the bunion to between second and third toe. It's definitely on the bottom of the foot.

I have custom insoles to help keep my feet from sliding into the "sixth toe" area.

It's worth noting that I can feel something similar on long hikes, to a lesser degree, and that shoes with stiffer soles seem to help in this regard.

I wondered if putting an Intuition liner in there would help, but my fitter thought it might be too limiting because the stock liner has cutouts for rear flex. (I do, however, own shears .....)

I've only worn them skiing maybe 2-4 times so far, so I think I only went back to the fitter once, when we did additional punching. I realize ideally you'd have more time in the boots than that before fiddling, but the discomfort is so much that it basically makes skinning more than 1 mile pretty miserable. Note that I'm very very slow, so a mile is like an hour

 

[MRT]

Hmmm---Mortons neuroma.

The usual fix is to incorporate a "metatarsal pad" into the footbed, in order to cascade the med heads apart (spread them out)

inside the boot and stop impinging the nerve. There is usually enough room inside a boot to do this. If your boot fitter can;t do it, look

for a fitter with Cped tacked on to his name

mike

 

[no edge]

Atomic Hawx 2.0 130 . A different feel than I am used to. But no issues.

I am in the Hawk 110. I need a thin aft and a wide toe box. It's working for me so far.