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Responsibility: Driving vs Skiing

Sibhusky

Whitefish, MT
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I remember when there was an urban legend circulating that snowboarders were playing the knockout game with random skiers out there.

Zero confirmation that anything like that ever happened on ski slopes. I do see people clowning around and trying to knock their friends down though.

I'd have said this happened to me more than once at Camelback. I got hit 6 times my last season there. 4 were snowboarders. One I particularly remember. I stop off to the side of an otherwise empty slope. I look uphill. Here comes a snowboarder. He turns, sees me, and comes right across the hill, straight into me. Like looking at me the whole traverse. I wasn't hurt enough to go report it, just cursed at him. This was in 2003, so I don't remember much about the other ones.
 

crgildart

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I love dogs but I've told people if their dog bites my kid they're going home with a dead dog and that's on them.
I love kids but have told people if their kid bites my dog they're going home with a dead kid and that's on them amirite?
 

Ivan

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This is from today:

A screenshot:
Screenshot 2024-01-14 at 21.16.14.jpg

Yes, theoretically, I should not have touched the guy, and should have held my pole in front of him as a barrier. Practically, he is very lucky that he didn't go flying head first into those nice trees on the left.
 

Andy Mink

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My goodness, the amount of bodily harm reported from a collision with another human being is unimaginable. Imagine the speed this had to have occurred at for someone to cause that much damage to another grown man’s body.
When I was involved in the collision about 6 weeks ago that broke my rib, I was hit harder than even a couple of car accidents in which I was involved. Basically, it was the hardest shot I ever recall taking. I can't imagine the forces that LeMaster sustained to cause his injuries. That the boarder was able to get off with little to no injury is amazing. Like the drunk driver who walks away from a horrific accident.

IMHO the laws need to be more consistent and the penalties for things like leaving the scene need to be prominently posted at all resorts and their social media outlets.

FWIW, neither of us left the scene before Patrol arrived. No finger pointing and, unless there were witnesses who saw it, neither know what happened, thus no blame. Obviously we both missed something though.
 

justplanesteve

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I got hit twice this past week on the same steep slope, predictable, round practice turns.
On Monday they were slow controlled turns, when i felt a "click" against the back of my boots and was sort of nudged forward. Looked down and there was a kid scrabbling backwards on the tails of my skis apologizing frenetically "sorry mister, sorry sir..." I grinned and asked him if he was ok as we both stopped moving.

The second, on Friday, was a much harder hit and i realized after the fact that it had addled me in terms of proper response.
A senior instructor was leading me in a funnel of decreasing magnitude carved turns, at a fair clip by the 3rd turn when suddenly i had the sensation of an incredible impact to my back & ribs just below the right shoulder blade, followed by visual stars & a spin on tumble dry in the laundromat. Things stopped moving with my legs interlaced and folded up in the lotus position, skis still attached underneath. Someone was dancing around above screaming at me as close as they could occasionally lunge toward my ear "you cut me off, you cut me off....". I could neither stand up, nor click off a ski from my tangled position and finally had presence of mind to calmly state "there is no such thing as cutting off on a ski slope, you ran into my back". The senior instructor told me later that another skier had arrived at the bottom and told him someone was hit bad and it looked like they broke both their legs.

My biggest concern was being down in the snow, in uniform, some maniac swearing, screaming & dancing above me, and the majority of the chairlift crowd who had not directly seen it being impressed i had crashed on my own, or quite possibly even thinking i was the culprit who hit another skier. I rolled over legs above head to untangle them, clicked out and stood up. The guy calmed down a little bit and stated: "so you are alright, right? You are OK? why did you cut me off?" Several people who had seen it stopped, but did not quite know what to do. I was the supposed "official" in uniform and not giving clear directions. I said i couldn't tell yet if i was actually OK, but nothing seemed broken. I repeated that he hit me from the rear, and that there is no such thing as "cutting off." The downhill skier has absolute right of way. This set him off into another tirade that ended up being successful on his part because it completely befuddled me.

He demanded to know how long i had been skiing and i said well i started in 1965. He began literally jumping up and down (on a fairly steep slope) with glee yelling "see, see, i've been skiing longer than you, you don't know the rules!" I was starting to find the whole thing so preposterous as to be funny and said "just how the heck old are you if you started before 1965?" He yelled "72!" I was almost starting to laugh, and said OK, you got me, i'll be 71 by the end of the season. That clinched it for him - He crowed triumphantly, "see, that proves it, you don't know the rules". "You haven't been skiing long enough to know the real rules." Someone else asked if i needed help and i said i thought i was probably OK. By then i just wanted to get away from the guy. We both acknowledged we seemed to be OK and skied off. I learned later that ski patrol had seen it. It would have been nice if some neutral party had lectured the guy a bit. Clearly i had lost my presence of mind to act in that capacity for myself, at least during the time it would have been productive.

smt
 

AmyPJ

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This jumped out at me from the article:
"It was the fifth skiing death at Eldora in 2021. Another ski-related death occurred at the resort in February. Eldora seems to have earned a deadly reputation among University of Colorado Boulder students, some of whom have taken to calling the resort “Dead-ora.” "

I had no idea LeMaster's injuries were that horrific. That young man had to have been hauling ass when he hit him.

All these stories just add to my extreme caution and paranoia. The resorts need to punish out-of-control or reckless behavior much more, and advertise that they are doing so.
 

KingGrump

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He demanded to know how long i had been skiing and i said well i started in 1965. He began literally jumping up and down (on a fairly steep slope) with glee yelling "see, see, i've been skiing longer than you, you don't know the rules!" I was starting to find the whole thing so preposterous as to be funny and said "just how the heck old are you if you started before 1965?" He yelled "72!" I was almost starting to laugh, and said OK, you got me, i'll be 71 by the end of the season. That clinched it for him - He crowed triumphantly, "see, that proves it, you don't know the rules". "You haven't been skiing long enough to know the real rules." Someone else asked if i needed help and i said i thought i was probably OK. By then i just wanted to get away from the guy. We both acknowledged we seemed to be OK and skied off. I learned later that ski patrol had seen it. It would have been nice if some neutral party had lectured the guy a bit. Clearly i had lost my presence of mind to act in that capacity for myself, at least during the time it would have been productive.

Should have call patrol to file an incident report. Especially when you are in uniform.
Let patrol record the incident for further reference. Especially the claim of "you cut me off."

Always have the ski area patrol number on direct dial.
 

crgildart

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Should have call patrol to file an incident report. Especially when you are in uniform.
Let patrol record the incident for further reference. Especially the claim of "you cut me off."

Always have the ski area patrol number on direct dial.
This. That fool might have gone straight to the ski school office demanding to speak with your manager..
My Snow.jpg
 

justplanesteve

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The comments to my post are on point & appreciated. :)

Here were 2 old geezers literally knocked "silly" - mildly in a state of temporary shock, behaving like cartoon characters.
At times like that, it is a blessing when someone else steps in and asks the appropriate questions, like should we trade names/numbers, should we ski down to patrol, etc, etc.
It even demonstrates why people claim to be cut off. As well as another way to pay attention to situational awareness. Starting from perfectly safe points, making assumptions about static positions, and then locking into a goal by both parties.

The other guy was upslope slightly, and not/or barely moving when we made the first turn below him. Turning with moderate speed across to the other side of the slope put him well behind us. Then swinging back under him we would assume him not to be factor as we scan forward over a very mild headwall, he would have assumed we were traveling the other direction as he began a high speed run down the edge, and wham.

Later I realized i had been watching him ski from the lift because it was distinctive - he looked like a kayaker paddling down the fall line. Alternate arms full forward, then full back with exaggerated rhythmic upper body rotation. I thought at the time that if he was fully wound up one way, he'd have to almost completely unwind the other before he could effectively change direction.

Nonetheless, "typical" assumptions one "can usually" make, combined with a cessation of situational awareness in favor orf completing a "task" had to be the major contributing factors for both of us. No doubt we, and a number of other people are relieved it was a lot less worse than the collision apparently appeared (& felt from my end). The experience has improved and I hope focused my concept of handling a similar situation if i see it occur.

smt
 
Last edited:

BLiP

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Should have call patrol to file an incident report. Especially when you are in uniform.
Absolutely would have reported this guy. Get it all down in writing. You might feel fine in the moment when your adrenaline is pumping, but a couple hours later realize that something is actually wrong.

At a minimum this guy needed a tongue lashing. Severe enough to knock out all 72 years of misinformation.
 

James

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Yeah I know someone who got hit pretty badly and kind of knocked out briefly. They thought they were “fine” just a badly bruised leg. He ended up getting compartment syndrome in his leg which is really dangerous. Fortunately the treatment worked out.
 

Hankj

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When I was involved in the collision about 6 weeks ago that broke my rib, I was hit harder than even a couple of car accidents in which I was involved. Basically, it was the hardest shot I ever recall taking. I can't imagine the forces that LeMaster sustained to cause his injuries.
Dude, sucks, sorry you had to go through it. Broken ribs are miserable, and take so damn long to get all the way right. Hope you recover quickly.

I got blasted head on, perfectly square, while cycling. An illegal e-scooter that was absolutely hauling azz toward me and lost control. It was absolutely shocking what the impact was like. Probably 35mph combining both our speeds.

I got my forearm up a little and it impacted his breast plate (douche was in full body armor). No cuts, but compression from impact literally blew my skin up all over my forearm the so I was running blood of my finger tips.

Positively blew me away the violence of the impact. Didn't hit my head at all, but soon after it became quite clear I had a concussion. After the fact a physicist friend explained to me that doubling collision speed about quadruples force. Some people ski/board 60mph inbounds. Yikes.

Anyway sucks, hope the rib get better soon!
 

crgildart

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Yeah I know someone who got hit pretty badly and kind of knocked out briefly. They thought they were “fine” just a badly bruised leg. He ended up getting compartment syndrome in his leg which is really dangerous. Fortunately the treatment worked out.
Natasha Richardson thought she was fine too..
 

Hankj

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He demanded to know how long i had been skiing and i said well i started in 1965. He began literally jumping up and down (on a fairly steep slope) with glee yelling "see, see, i've been skiing longer than you, you don't know the rules!"
I'm aging out of being reactive to stuff like this, but if it was me it's a coin flip if this guy learned what the tip of a ski pole tastes like. You handled it great - bravo for keeping your cool.
 

crgildart

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Any body ever wait for them to ski off then follow them just out of sight waiting for an opportunity to blast them from behind? I mean don't say anything unless the statute of limitation has expired..
 

Andy Mink

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Dude, sucks, sorry you had to go through it. Broken ribs are miserable, and take so damn long to get all the way right. Hope you recover quickly.

I got blasted head on, perfectly square, while cycling. An illegal e-scooter that was absolutely hauling azz toward me and lost control. It was absolutely shocking what the impact was like. Probably 35mph combining both our speeds.

I got my forearm up a little and it impacted his breast plate (douche was in full body armor). No cuts, but compression from impact literally blew my skin up all over my forearm the so I was running blood of my finger tips.

Positively blew me away the violence of the impact. Didn't hit my head at all, but soon after it became quite clear I had a concussion. After the fact a physicist friend explained to me that doubling collision speed about quadruples force. Some people ski/board 60mph inbounds. Yikes.

Anyway sucks, hope the rib get better soon!
Luckily the rib has healed enough to ski. The only time it gets achy is lying down.
 

COSkier87

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The ones that scare me the most are people who fly out of the glades right into your path, but are technically downhill of you. Almost hit a guy once who flew off a 5 foot bank on the right side of the trail while he was holding a selfie camera, landed a couple feet in front of me. Was thankfully able to maneuver at the last second, but there is literally no time to react in those situations.
 

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