Boot stiffness considerations for racing

[maxwerks]

@onenerdykid I have a question for a friend. Based on her FIS points she was eligible to get the non retail 170 Carbo 90mm boots (photo). We were wondering if these shells are made out of heat moldable plastic, do you know?

 

[onenerdykid]

Boots like this STI are simply too thick to toss into an oven. They need the traditional approach of grinding & stretching.

 

[maxwerks]

Boots like this STI are simply too thick to toss into an oven. They need the traditional approach of grinding & stretching.

Gotcha, of course. But do you know if the material is thermomoldable?

 

[onenerdykid]

Gotcha, of course. But do you know if the material is thermomoldable?

Almost every plastic is heat moldable - we've been stretching boots for over 30 years. Some plastics are more easily moldable than others and resist "shrinking" back once they've been molded, but the type of PU used in our Redster boots is incredibly moldable. It's just too thick of a plastic for the pressure of your foot/body to move it and prevent it from shrinking back.

 

[maxwerks]

Almost every plastic is heat moldable - we've been stretching boots for over 30 years. Some plastics are more easily moldable than others and resist "shrinking" back once they've been molded, but the type of PU used in our Redster boots is incredibly moldable. It's just too thick of a plastic for the pressure of your foot/body to move it and prevent it from shrinking back.

Ok, so if I understand correctly, these boots differ from retail STI that are marked memory fit, not so much due to different plastics but thicker walls. If we put them on scales I guess they would be quite a bit heavier

 

[onenerdykid]

Ok, so if I understand correctly, these boots differ from retail STI that are marked memory fit, not so much due to different plastics but thicker walls. If we put them on scales I guess they would be quite a bit heavier

We stopped printing "Memory Fit" on TI & STI boots in the 21/22 season for the reason I mentioned above. It's to get people to stop putting TI & STI boots in ovens and resort to the traditional means of fitting.

The boot in the picture is an H/I-B combination (H/I shell hardness, B cuff hardness). This combination is not available in our normal FIS catalog, it's only available through APC dealers.

The plastic thickness is the same as every other STI - plastic thickness is based on the last & mold and is always the same.

 

[Tony Storaro]

We stopped printing "Memory Fit" on TI & STI boots in the 21/22 season for the reason I mentioned above. It's to get people to stop putting TI & STI boots in ovens and resort to the traditional means of fitting.

The boot in the picture is an H/I-B combination (H/I shell hardness, B cuff hardness). This combination is not available in our normal FIS catalog, it's only available through APC dealers.

The plastic thickness is the same as every other STI - plastic thickness is based on the last & mold and is always the same.

Can the dual component lifters be fitted on Ti 150? I have ideas.

 

[onenerdykid]

Can the dual component lifters be fitted on Ti 150? I have ideas.

They don't perfectly match the shape of the sole, but they can be adapted to fit onto TI & STI.

 

[James]

Heh, trying to fit that boot after heating enough in an oven is going to have it look like Claes Oldenburg’s melting telephone.

 

[Rudi Riet]

D'Oh... Skiers weight is an important component of flex. 165 here

Not just weight: strength is another part, femoral length vis-a-vis tib/fib length is another, as is dorsiflexion ability, as are so many other variables.

There are some smaller skiers (in the 150-165 lb range) who rock plugs with a 150 flex index. They're also strong as can be - not bulky, but strong.

 

[Swede]

The combination of ski technique and strength determine how much power you can put down in your boot, binding, plate and ski. If you are strong and technically advanced, your speed determine what is appropriate regarding how burly equipment you can make use of/need. A 250 lbs male lacking in technique and strength do not put down as much force as a 126 lbs Tessa Worley.

 

[bluefish]

I keep putting my feet into the new Head 140s I bought. A bit of contact on the inside right ankle bone and the forefoot of both feet but esp. the right foot uncomfortable in the boot. Best to grind these shells for fit?

 

[evr66]

Hi all, last week i tried a set of “team issue” 150 H/A boots and loved it! Not fitted , so comfort was lacking a bit, but skiing much better than my current boots Fischer vacuum 130). Is this the same boot as the wifedpread ti150?

 

[markojp]

I keep putting my feet into the new Head 140s bought. A bit of contact on the inside right ankle bone and the forefoot of both feet but esp. the right foot uncomfortable in the boot. Best to grind these shells for fit?

Depends. The plastic isn't super thick in the WCR RS 140, so likely a bunch, or a combo of a grind and punch.... or maybe just a grind... you see where we're going here. To your local competent fitter.

 

[onenerdykid]

Hi all, last week i tried a set of “team issue” 150 H/A boots and loved it! Not fitted , so comfort was lacking a bit, but skiing much better than my current boots Fischer vacuum 130). Is this the same boot as the wifedpread ti150?

TI stands for Team Issue.

All model years are the same last & mold.

150 boot in picture uses an "H" hardness shell and an "A" hardness cuff. Current year 150 boots use H-shell and B-cuff.

 

[evr66]

Thanks, noticable differences between H/A and H/B in skiiing? I tried the "A" (which I really liked) and will probably receive the current "B" model

 

[onenerdykid]

Thanks, noticable differences between H/A and H/B in skiiing? I tried the "A" (which I really liked) and will probably receive the current "B" model

Yes, it is noticeably stiffer. Whether that is good or bad for you I can't say. But it is noticeable.

 

[geepers]

Reilly is a fantastic skier but he is not in the same league with the rest. Technique-wise he may be close but strength and power-no chance. He is much more of a finesse skier compared to those beasts.

There's two Reilly's. The one before the hip problems and the one after.

Side note: I have serious doubts about the claim that top men's WC level slalom skiers are using a 120 flex... Maybe it was tested in a very specific condition/temperature, but I don't see how it could possibly be used by such an athlete. Not a single WC Atomic athlete (men or women) use a 130 in any discipline. Most of our SL men are in boots far stiffer than 150, meaning 150 is far too soft. For the 22/23 season, we even made our stock 150 boots with a stiffer cuff (moving from A to B hardness) to closer resemble what Europa & World Cup racers are using, across disciplines.

Always thought that Fischer Product Manager meant The Rocket. But apparently not...

Relevant bit starts at 15:45. Doesn't quote a number - just that of the Fischer guys he's one with the softest flex. Also says he's big (easily over 6ft 2") and heavy.

episodes | The Next Turn

www.thenextturnpodcast.com

 

[Ivan]

There's two Reilly's. The one before the hip problems and the one after.



Always thought that Fischer Product Manager meant The Rocket. But apparently not...

Relevant bit starts at 15:45. Doesn't quote a number - just that of the Fischer guys he's one with the softest flex. Also says he's big (easily over 6ft 2") and heavy.

episodes | The Next Turn

www.thenextturnpodcast.com

I'd add that there are now several podcasts with Ted Ligety (a couple on the Next Turn, and one on Big Picture Skiing), where he repeated several times that while he normally used really stiff boots for slalom, he always used relatively soft boots for GS. In particular, they made cuts in the boots to make them easier to flex forward.

 

[geepers]

I'd add that there are now several podcasts with Ted Ligety (a couple on the Next Turn, and one on Big Picture Skiing), where he repeated several times that while he normally used really stiff boots for slalom, he always used relatively soft boots for GS. In particular, they made cuts in the boots to make them easier to flex forward.

He mentioned that in the podcast on The Next Turn. Said the reason for softer SG boots - softer than for GS - was he to get into proper tuck in the gliding sections although he did just fine on the tech sections in the GS boots.