U10 Slalom Ski vs Multi Event

[beantownace]

Hello all,

Question for those that have had U10 athletes and have or currently coach. Traditionally I know that U10 level are in multi event skis as my daughter was as a U10. Is there any issue with going with a sole SL ski such as an Atomic S9 Redster for example for a U10 that is skiing pretty strong? Can that be used for GS races for smaller athletes as they are mostly doing skills days versus true races but they are races nevertheless. Thanks for any opinions I think it would make a good ski for stubbies but curious about GS races if not a good option versus a multi event.

 

[nnowak]

A multi-event ski has a turn radius in between a SL and GS ski. Multi-event skis also tend to have a softer flex and are more forgiving than the dedicated SL and GS skis. Using your S9 example, the smallest size is 124cm with an 8.9m radius. The 138cm G9 has a 14.5m radius. A 130cm J9 "Allround" ski that would sit in between has an 11m radius.

While you could ski GS on the SL ski, it would not be ideal as it would be twitchier and harder to make clean round turns. Spending a lot of time skiing GS on the SL ski could also make the transition to a dedicated GS ski more awkward in later years. You should either stick with the single multi-event ski that splits the difference, or get both SL and GS skis. USSA recommends a single pair of multi-event skis at the U10 level, but skill levels, strength, and weight vary dramatically at that age. Having separate SL and GS skis certainly won't be a detriment at the U10 level, but depending on the skill level of the athlete, there may also be no benefit.

Used GS skis in U10 sizes tend to be really inexpensive. Given how little abuse GS skis see at the U10 level, you can easily pick up 5 year old used GS skis that are still in great shape. Used multi-event skis in a GS length could also be substituted for the dedicated GS ski.

 

[Philpug]

Way back when when I was selling race skis, lighter kids we tended to put on combo skis over SL or GS skis. To bridge the difference, we would use the Look NX7 with the lifter. Two things need to be considered with kids skis, they should grow out of them and not into them, that can be as much length and flex. Second, if they can't bend the ski it's not going to turn.

 

[robertc3]

I asked this question to our race team's program director trying to help my brother find skis for his U10 son. The PD's suggestion was an SL ski in a GS length. His reasoning was that the SL ski initiates the turn more easily than a GS or even a multi-event ski and if it is tipped less it will make a GS arc and if tipped more it will make an SL arc. My kids were on multi-event skis at U10. They worked fine, but were not anything close to a real race ski. When my son got on his first pair of true SL skis he was blown away by the edge hold and how well they carved. Going to a longer SL ski would get your daughter into a better ski now that would become her true SL ski next season and you could add a true GS ski at that point.

 

[nnowak]

I asked this question to our race team's program director trying to help my brother find skis for his U10 son. The PD's suggestion was an SL ski in a GS length. His reasoning was that the SL ski initiates the turn more easily than a GS or even a multi-event ski and if it is tipped less it will make a GS arc and if tipped more it will make an SL arc. My kids were on multi-event skis at U10. They worked fine, but were not anything close to a real race ski. When my son got on his first pair of true SL skis he was blown away by the edge hold and how well they carved. Going to a longer SL ski would get your daughter into a better ski now that would become her true SL ski next season and you could add a true GS ski at that point.

Quite honestly, that sounds like terrible advice. For a U10 or U12, their GS ski is typically 10-15cm longer than their SL ski. Using this advice would put the kid on a ski that is 2 to 3 sizes longer than what they should be on. I would be very concerned that the kid would not have enough weight/strength to properly flex a ski that was so dramatically oversized. It might be OK on a GS run, but would make slalom turns far more challenging, especially with how tight course sets can be at that age.

Used race skis for younger kids tend to be cheap and plentiful. I don't see the point of trying to cut corners and put kids on skis that are not the right fit.

The only time I can think of where it makes sense to buy a race ski the kid can "grow into" is to purchase a U16 GS ski for use with U12 SG. Once the kid is older, that former "SG" ski becomes their GS skis.

 

[AlpsSkidad]

I think it comes down to your coaches and what they think your kid can ski. We did U10 in Europe and I distinctly remember days where some new kids would show up to training in Multi Event skis for whatever discipline it was that day, or SL skis on GS training day, and the coach would ask the kid about the skis, and if they had the correct ones. Often those kids would say no (it was the beginning of the season) and the coach would send them to the ski rental shop to go get the correct skis for the day. It was clearly laid out to the parents that they expected U10s to have separate SL and GS skis. Used/old/rental was fine. Just had to be the correct discipline ski in the correct length.

 

[GB_Ski]

My kid's program just changed their long standing requirement of GS/SL skis for U10 group to single multi-event skis. Only U12 requires GS/SL now. It might be cost driven, but I suspect they realized most of the GS/SL skis are just too stiff for U10 kids. A quick search will show most of those skis have plates now.

 

[Brian Finch]

I'm going to but many * on here:

I have a a second year u10 & she's small but rips. Last year she was on a multi, This year I have her going on a SL. The difference in my head is that she is ready for a ski with a plate & I choose by size.

* above was confirmed by smarter coaches than me
** I have a u14 too & have seen the circuit
***u12 is where our mtn / region GS
****I have a coach license
*****yet I do more elite / D1 / WC / Academy perf enhancement as a physio
******don't coach my kids

 

[nnowak]

My kid's program just changed their long standing requirement of GS/SL skis for U10 group to single multi-event skis. Only U12 requires GS/SL now. It might be cost driven, but I suspect they realized most of the GS/SL skis are just too stiff for U10 kids. A quick search will show most of those skis have plates now.

Those plates are actually a good thing as they make the ski easier to flex. That same ski without a plate would feel stiffer. The only reason the multi-event skis don't come with a plate is for cost cutting. A side benefit is it is much easier to adjust bindings for various boot sizes as you don't need to drill the ski for every change. The ONLY downside to a plate is that you are now tied to a specific binding manufacturer.

 

[TahoeWarrior]

Interesting and valuable thread. My son will be moving up to first year u10 next year, he will be 8 yo and is def lighter than many. Leaning heavily towards the multi event ski per coaches recommendation.
Q: Rossi/Dynastar and Head clearly market/label a junior multi event ski, but what about other brands? Atomic Redster naming, as example, is not straightforward. Does anyone have a master list of Multi Event /Combi junior skis?
And, are they all the same or are some stiffer, etc.?

 

[jt10000]

Q: Rossi/Dynastar and Head clearly market/label a junior multi event ski, but what about other brands?

I think Blizzard does. I'm not sure what it's called. Hickory & Tweed in Armonk NY has a bunch they use as seasonal rentals for the littles in racing programs.

 

[GB_Ski]

Atomic has the J2/4/9 series.
Nordica has the Kombi and Kombi Pro.
Fischer has the RC4 Race Jr.
Blizzard has the Firebird Competition.
AFAIK, Volkl doesn't have combi skis.

Many of these companies have two variations to the kombi skis. Rossi/Dyna for example have the Hero Multi-Event and Hero Athlete Multi-Event, they are not the same skis (different constructions).

 

[Ivan]

Interesting and valuable thread. My son will be moving up to first year u10 next year, he will be 8 yo and is def lighter than many. Leaning heavily towards the multi event ski per coaches recommendation.
Q: Rossi/Dynastar and Head clearly market/label a junior multi event ski, but what about other brands? Atomic Redster naming, as example, is not straightforward. Does anyone have a master list of Multi Event /Combi junior skis?
And, are they all the same or are some stiffer, etc.?

You need to search individual brand websites. For instance, Fischer has a couple of combi skis:

RC4 WORLDCUP JR.

The Sidecut design and World Cup technology make this an excellent, highly versatile race ski for advanced Juniors to race both Slalom and Giant…

www.fischersports.com

RC4 PRO + FS7

Manoeuvrable junior race ski with a broad range of use. Offers maximum torsional stiffness and top edge grip on ice through its Sidewall Construction.

www.fischersports.com

The former are described as a proper race ski with a sandwich construction and a plate (and they are in the Competition Race, not Junior/Kids) section of the website; the latter seem to be a bit more accessible (though they still have a sidewall constriction).

 

[TahoeWarrior]

Atomic has the J2/4/9 series.
Nordica has the Kombi and Kombi Pro.
Fischer has the RC4 Race Jr.
Blizzard has the Firebird Competition.
AFAIK, Volkl doesn't have combi skis.

Many of these companies have two variations to the kombi skis. Rossi/Dyna for example have the Hero Multi-Event and Hero Athlete Multi-Event, they are not the same skis (different constructions).

Thank you! Because different manufacturers use differing marketing and descriptions for what seems to be Combi skis, it makes it harder to clearly identify - for a newbie at least!

 

[TahoeWarrior]

You need to search individual brand websites. For instance, Fischer has a couple of combi skis:

RC4 WORLDCUP JR.

The Sidecut design and World Cup technology make this an excellent, highly versatile race ski for advanced Juniors to race both Slalom and Giant…

www.fischersports.com

RC4 PRO + FS7

Manoeuvrable junior race ski with a broad range of use. Offers maximum torsional stiffness and top edge grip on ice through its Sidewall Construction.

www.fischersports.com

The former are described as a proper race ski with a sandwich construction and a plate (and they are in the Competition Race, not Junior/Kids) section of the website; the latter seem to be a bit more accessible (though they still have a sidewall constriction).

Also, helpful. Are some of these Muti Event or Combi skis known to be stiffer or less than others? Or, at this U10 combi level, are they basically all pretty similar? I ask as my son skis aggressive, but he is pretty light ~50lbs at age 7-8 for ex.

 

[Ivan]

Also, helpful. Are some of these Muti Event or Combi skis known to be stiffer or less than others? Or, at this U10 combi level, are they basically all pretty similar? I ask as my son skis aggressive, but he is pretty light ~50lbs at age 7-8 for ex.

There are definitely some differences. For instance, the Dynastar Team Comp are noticeably stiffer than the Team Speed. In turn, the RC4 Pro that I linked above ate stiffer than the Team Comp. One way to tell would be to ask your kid's coaches; if that's not an option, I'd look at the construction. Full sandwich (RC4 Worldcup Jr) would probably be stiffer than just sidewall (RC4 Pro); sidewall is stiffer than plain cap (Team Comp or Team Speed).

Another thing that varies a lot is the turn radius. The Team Comp is 6m in 110cm; the RC4 Pro is 9m in 110cm. I'm in the same boat (I have an 8-year-old who was in a developmental program this season and will be in a U10 program next season), and I feel like sometimes it's just trial and error. Or maybe if there are teammates you could borrow skis from, that might be an option to try different skis, too.

 

[Swede]

If you can find the Elan RCX plate, it is one of the best U10 ME skis inmo. Tyrolia bindings on them. 122 or 128 cm, if you can find older models they were 125 and 130 cm.

New Kid's Elan RCX Race Skis with Race Plate (Bindings not included) | SidelineSwap

Shop New Elan RCX Skis up to 70% off – or start selling in seconds. SidelineSwap is where athletes buy and sell their gear.

sidelineswap.com

 

[GB_Ski]

Honestly, unless your child is really ahead or behind on the growth chart, most “advanced” skis will do for U10. Skis rarely make or break, but too big of boots or wrong clothes or even wrong groups of kids and coaches match will really make the season tough. The worst is helicopter parents.

Just accept that ski racing is a stupidly expensive sports to be in, at least in the US. It’s a truly arm race. You don’t have to participate in that frenzy, but your kid(s) will feel the social pressure.

 

[Brian Finch]

If you can find the Elan RCX plate, it is one of the best U10 ME skis inmo. Tyrolia bindings on them. 122 or 128 cm, if you can find older models they were 125 and 130 cm.

New Kid's Elan RCX Race Skis with Race Plate (Bindings not included) | SidelineSwap

Shop New Elan RCX Skis up to 70% off – or start selling in seconds. SidelineSwap is where athletes buy and sell their gear.

sidelineswap.com

That’s a really good deal. We had a silly time sourcing some 125cm Fischers w a plate this past season-

 

[RoccoH]

There are definitely some differences. For instance, the Dynastar Team Comp are noticeably stiffer than the Team Speed. In turn, the RC4 Pro that I linked above ate stiffer than the Team Comp. One way to tell would be to ask your kid's coaches; if that's not an option, I'd look at the construction. Full sandwich (RC4 Worldcup Jr) would probably be stiffer than just sidewall (RC4 Pro); sidewall is stiffer than plain cap (Team Comp or Team Speed).

Another thing that varies a lot is the turn radius. The Team Comp is 6m in 110cm; the RC4 Pro is 9m in 110cm. I'm in the same boat (I have an 8-year-old who was in a developmental program this season and will be in a U10 program next season), and I feel like sometimes it's just trial and error. Or maybe if there are teammates you could borrow skis from, that might be an option to try different skis, too.

Same situation here, my daughter is going to U10, coming from U8 this year, and she is light (23 kg) and tiny (123 cm) and she is now starting to carve the turns. Decided to try the Dynastar Team Comp in 110 after consultation with her coach as we both felt a true race ski would still be too much for her. Her current skis are Fischer RC4 jr 100 with a 10m radius so the tighter 6m radius of the Dynas will be quite a change. SL only.

Also when you enter the dimensions of this specific ski in the FIS radius calculator with an estimate of the center distance, it appears to be more of a 7-ish meter radius. I'll measure it up later as it will be delivered today.