Overlap to Cabrio....Did I make a mistake?

[Idahosnow]

Why are you seeking a "very light boot"? Unless you're earning your turns (slogging uphill), the only time you might really notice the weight of a boot is on the chairlift. Light boots must have compromises on how they ski. Basically I'm advising you to not make a different mistake with the same piece of gear. If your goal is to have a better skiing experience, do not include "light weight" as something to strive for in an alpine downhill ski boot.

No, I'm not looking for a lightweight boot. I was quoting/asking Ken R who said not to look at lightweight boots in response to my earlier post in which I said that the S/max was the current frontrunner of boots I've tried on. This is for resort only. I don't care what the boot weighs.

I wasn't sure if he was referring to the S/Max. I'll look into that. It was just what the shop had and what I tried on. I haven't done any research yet.

 

[old_man_steeze]

No, I'm not looking for a lightweight boot. I was quoting/asking Ken R who said not to look at lightweight boots in response to my earlier post in which I said that the S/max was the current frontrunner of boots I've tried on. This is for resort only. I don't care what the boot weighs.

I wasn't sure if he was referring to the S/Max. I'll look into that. It was just what the shop had and what I tried on. I haven't done any research yet.

Old thread, but which overlap boot did you end up going with over the Kryptons, and did you end up staying with them/finally finding something that’s worked well for you over the long-term??

 

[NE_Skier]

It was way past time to retire my boots. My new boots are growing on me, but It's not love. Any advice is appreciated.

Old Boots: Very old Lange Banshee, Intuition powerwrap, punched for 6th toe. 300 BSL. Were great but started getting a lot of shin bang.
New Boots: Dalbello Kryption Fusion ID120, intuition wrap (not as stiff as powerwrap), punched for 6th toe 297 BSL.

These were both fit by a master bootfitter. My new boots were ridiculously tight the first few days of skiing. With super thin sock and 4 ski days they are now wearable for a ski day without frequent unbuckles.

While I'm getting used to them, I just don't seem to have the confidence I did in my old boots. On edge, turning, they feel good. When I'm skiing really fast my skis feel a bit wobbly, especially if I'm running bases flat. They also just don't feel as precise. The first thing I did was grab my insoles (blue superfeet) from my old boots to replace the ones I tried in my new boots. Better. Then I put the stiffener in the (middle position) the boot spine. Better. My next thought is to try the biggest (currently have the middle) forward lean shim and perhaps bump the spine stiffener to the highest position. Any thoughts on these adjustments?

One other issue.....With boots on, my toes touch the end. A forward lean pulls them back from the ends wonderfully with a nice lock on my heel in the pocket. As I ski, my toes seem to be moving back and forth a little too much and are bumping the front often. Not hard, but noticeable and annoying. Yes, I tend to get backseat more than I should. Is there something I can do to help keep my heel and toes pulled back? These superfeet insoles have a slippery top especially with the Snow Whisper socks I'm using. Could that be the culprit or is it the 3mm smaller shell or do I need to fine-tune my buckles?

I can and will go back to the bootfitter, but I'm hoping to try some stuff before I do. Any suggestions or tricks to try? Anyone else struggle going to a cabrio boot? Maybe it's not for me. Maybe it's in my head, but unfortunately, it's in my head. On a positive note, putting these on and taking them off is so much nicer than my old boots.

I am having similar experience. I bought Dalbello Rampage boots ~ 4 yrs ago from an expert bootfitter and they definitely are the best fitting and most comfortable boots I've had. However, I also have the toe bumping (some of that is my form as I don't keep my weight forward enough) and I always feel that the boots aren't quite stiff enough and that causes some wobbliness in my skis. The Rampage don't have a rear adjuster for stiffness so the most I can do is get the power strap as tight as possible. Also, I think these boots are a 120 flex so does anyone think a Dalbello in a 130 flex could solve some of this?

I'm wondering if this is just a know trade-off and no perfect solution - the cabrio design is way more comfortable and user friendly in terms of putting them on but they seem to lack in performance.

 

[Idahosnow]

Old thread, but which overlap boot did you end up going with over the Kryptons, and did you end up staying with them/finally finding something that’s worked well for you over the long-term??

First off, I'm cheap. So when I saw a skied-in 5 days boot for about 80% off in my size, I gave them a try. Head Nexo Lyt 120. People advised against a light boot, but these have been fantastic. I skied the original liner for a few days and they were alright. On a whim, I stuck my very old intuition liners in the new boots and have been skiing happily ever since. I'm shocked the old liners fit the new shell so well. The liner is definitely past its prime, so I will have a new one molded in the near future.

 

[Idahosnow]

I am having similar experience. I bought Dalbello Rampage boots ~ 4 yrs ago from an expert bootfitter and they definitely are the best fitting and most comfortable boots I've had. However, I also have the toe bumping (some of that is my form as I don't keep my weight forward enough) and I always feel that the boots aren't quite stiff enough and that causes some wobbliness in my skis. The Rampage don't have a rear adjuster for stiffness so the most I can do is get the power strap as tight as possible. Also, I think these boots are a 120 flex so does anyone think a Dalbello in a 130 flex could solve some of this?

I'm wondering if this is just a know trade-off and no perfect solution - the cabrio design is way more comfortable and user friendly in terms of putting them on but they seem to lack in performance.

It was definitely a trade-off for me. Maybe I just didn't have the correct boot or fit. The cabrio design is used by a lot of amazing skiers...almost every mogul skier....and it works for them.

 

[locknload]

I'm skiing in the Lange RX 130. Phenomenal boot for all mtn performance...stiff...powerful and hugs my foot perfectly. No shin bang, and no problems with the toes slamming into the front. Most of this is due to the right boot, good footbeds and my Zip Fits. Generally...I'm happier than I've ever been in my boots except for 2 things:

1. Getting in and out of my boots is brutal especially when its cold. I have mastered two ways to get in with the plastic shoe horn and putting my foot in the liner first, and being and able to pry the flaps open enough to jam my foot in. It really is a lot more work than it should be. It's easier getting them off but still takes work.
2. Bumps: I'm an ok bump skier and always working on it...I do wish the boots had a bit more progressive flex when dealing with steep, big bumps.

I am wondering how different the ride would be in the Krypton pro...and if it would be more fun in the bumps with a small tradeoff in performance on groomers ( I mostly ski off piste and on softer days anway). Certainly am not going to get rid of my Langes...just always searching the optimum set up. Anyone else gone back and forth between overlap and cabrio boots?

 

[dan ross]

Anyone else gone back and forth between overlap and cabrio boots?

Yes, back in the day, sometimes on the same day. Flexors and a traditional Technica. I had a 2boot quiver for several years but my feet aren’t hard to fit. Flexons for bumps and screwing around and The Technica for corduroy, blue ice, etc. ( stiffer skis) There are advantages and disadvantage to both designs but I skied enough then that transitioning between the two was not an issue. My situation might have been unusual but my feeling was basically, use the right tool for the job.

 

[locknload]

Yes, back in the day, sometimes on the same day. Flexors and a traditional Technica. I had a 2boot quiver for several years but my feet aren’t hard to fit. Flexons for bumps and screwing around and The Technica for corduroy, blue ice, etc. ( stiffer skis) There are advantages and disadvantage to both designs but I skied enough then that transitioning between the two was not an issue. My situation might have been unusual but my feeling was basically, use the right tool for the job.

Thx, Dan. This is sort of my thinking as well. I don't have a terribly difficult foot to fit either. Fairly symmetrical feet and ankles. I may go into a shop and try on the Kryptons and see how they feel with me zip fits and footbeds inside the shell.

 

[dan ross]

Thx, Dan. This is sort of my thinking as well. I don't have a terribly difficult foot to fit either. Fairly symmetrical feet and ankles. I may go into a shop and try on the Kryptons and see how they feel with me zip fits and footbeds inside the shell.

Hopefully, you can find everything you need in one boot.
But, if the advantages outweigh the disadvantages, I wouldn’t really think twice about having two. Different tools for different tasks just make sure your bindings can adjust to differences in BSL.

 

[Andy Mink]

Getting in and out of my boots is brutal especially when its cold.

We've tried this and it does work. Yes, you must be careful because it does get hot but holding a reasonable distance from the boot and keeping it moving warms the plastic enough to make life easier.

 

[Pat AKA mustski]

Or carry a blowdryer. It's a little safer and most lodges have electric outlets. Full disclosure ... we bought one of the battery operated heat guns for when we need heat but have no outlet to plug in a hair dryer.

 

[onenerdykid]

I'm skiing in the Lange RX 130. Phenomenal boot for all mtn performance...stiff...powerful and hugs my foot perfectly. No shin bang, and no problems with the toes slamming into the front. Most of this is due to the right boot, good footbeds and my Zip Fits. Generally...I'm happier than I've ever been in my boots except for 2 things:

1. Getting in and out of my boots is brutal especially when its cold. I have mastered two ways to get in with the plastic shoe horn and putting my foot in the liner first, and being and able to pry the flaps open enough to jam my foot in. It really is a lot more work than it should be. It's easier getting them off but still takes work.
2. Bumps: I'm an ok bump skier and always working on it...I do wish the boots had a bit more progressive flex when dealing with steep, big bumps.

I am wondering how different the ride would be in the Krypton pro...and if it would be more fun in the bumps with a small tradeoff in performance on groomers ( I mostly ski off piste and on softer days anway). Certainly am not going to get rid of my Langes...just always searching the optimum set up. Anyone else gone back and forth between overlap and cabrio boots?

A couple of things to clarify: overlap boots (like your Lange) offer a more progressive flex, i.e. they get progressively stiffer the more you push into them. Cabrio boots (like a Krypton) offer a more linear flex, i.e. they don't get as stiff the more you push into them. The reason your Lange is more work in the bumps is because the boot's flex is progressive- you flexing them forward when encountering the bump makes them stiffer.

My advice - since your Lange's fit you well and you are looking for a more forgiving boot for off-piste skiing, just get the Lange RX 120 and swap your Zip Fits into it. This will give you the two boot quiver you are looking for (hard snow on-piste boot and soft snow off-piste boot) but keep you in the same fit, same boot geometry, same binding adjustment. Way easier and less of change than bouncing between an overlap and a cabrio with a different sole profile and BSL.

 

[markojp]

It was definitely a trade-off for me. Maybe I just didn't have the correct boot or fit. The cabrio design is used by a lot of amazing skiers...almost every mogul skier....and it works for them.

The flexon design, yes. The Dalbello design, no. Honestly, the only person ive ever seen ski the Dalbello design well is Drew Tabke. I've sent 4 or 5 instructors preparing for L3 in Dalbello Kryptons in for new boots.. great lateral response, but ankles just didn’t work. Most bought boots that were too stiff. If one skis say a Lange RX 130, a Dalbello cabrio in 110 or 120 is enough. I just don't see enough suspension in the ankle for most in the Dalbello's... no suspension, no fore/aft. No fore/aft, it's pretty hard to move accurately/consistently in functional dynamic balance.

 

[locknload]

A couple of things to clarify: overlap boots (like your Lange) offer a more progressive flex, i.e. they get progressively stiffer the more you push into them. Cabrio boots (like a Krypton) offer a more linear flex, i.e. they don't get as stiff the more you push into them. The reason your Lange is more work in the bumps is because the boot's flex is progressive- you flexing them forward when encountering the bump makes them stiffer.

My advice - since your Lange's fit you well and you are looking for a more forgiving boot for off-piste skiing, just get the Lange RX 120 and swap your Zip Fits into it. This will give you the two boot quiver you are looking for (hard snow on-piste boot and soft snow off-piste boot) but keep you in the same fit, same boot geometry, same binding adjustment. Way easier and less of change than bouncing between an overlap and a cabrio with a different sole profile and BSL.

Thanks for this suggestion. Appreciate your input and advice as a master boot fitter.

 

[locknload]

Thanks for this suggestion. Appreciate your input and advice as a master boot fitter.

Maybe even an opportunity to explore the new Lange Shadow 120!

 

[locknload]

We've tried this and it does work. Yes, you must be careful because it does get hot but holding a reasonable distance from the boot and keeping it moving warms the plastic enough to make life easier.

View attachment 192202

Iiiiiinteresting. I may have to explore this option. If its a cold day...say 20 or below....getting these boots off at the car is like prying a vice from my feet! Lol. I can do it...but not without considerable work.