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2016-17 Mammoth/"Calif4nia" Conditions/Meetups Thread

TonyC

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How do you think the conditions will be on Philippes, Paranoids, Hangman, Huevos Grande, Daves, Climax, Dropout etc?

From past experience (July skiing at Mammoth in 7 prior seasons) I can make some educated guesses. The core, easily accessed runs from the top, Climax, Cornice and the Drop Outs/Wipe Outs should be fine for July 1-4. Hangman's is al;so accessible and should ski fine until its throat melts out, which this year should be later than the July 1-4 holiday. Outlying runs are more problematic. The key issue is suncupping in areas that aren't skied very much. This is one reason it's great that Mammoth runs daily and not just on weekends.

With outer areas the runs may have tons of snow but the approaches to them burn off. YOU may be fine with hiking 5 minutes over scree to access a run, but 95% of skiers aren't. And if enough people aren't doing it, the suncupping will progress, the snow will degrade and become not worth skiing.

Skyline was already marginal over Memorial Day and Roadrunner is likely melted out now too. The approach from the very top of the Paranoids had also lost its snow by Memorial Day. Thus the only access to Scotty's and beyond is via Wipe Out 2/Hump, then traversing to skier's left. Typically there will be a couple of nice skier packed lines in Monument and Paranoid 1, but nothing beyond that. With this year's snowpack maybe you can continue that traverse out to P2, P3 and Philippe's for a while longer than usual, but I think it's close call whether it will be any good beyond P1 by July 1.

The long traverse over to Dave's usually burns off during the early June gondola maintenance period. I have no recollection of ever skiing Dave's in July. Access to Huevos without hiking is very unlikely IMHO; thus I suspect its snow won't be good by July either.

but (and I'm happy to be proven wrong) I'm skeptical that they'll make it to August with anything worth skiing. The temps are high and the melt is happening fast.
Based on 2011 I'm optimistic about the July 1-4 holiday. Stump should be open, which opens more lower mountain salted groomers plus makes the chair 5 terrain accessible with exit via Comeback Trail to chair 2. St. Anton should be open, allowing long top to bottom runs skier's left of chair 23. And the race course runs under chair 1 usually stay in good shape midday when the other lower groomers get too sticky.

The skiing gets more limited after St. Anton and chair 2 close. This is the situation on most July 4 closing weekends but will occur a week or two into July this year. And finally the lower mountain will burn out, leaving just chair 3 and the upper gondola. Later in July I would expect just Cornice, Climax, Saddle Bowl and maybe face of 3 open. That's still worth getting a ski day in but perhaps not multiple days. But I'll still go up there to check it out as there are many other things to do in the area.

If Saddle Bowl gets to be a narrow WROD like the closing last year with Cornice being the only run open with any elbow room, that's the point it might not be worth the trip IMHO. But I'm guessing Mammoth needs more than that to run the race camps, which is why they are staying open into August.
 

SallyCat

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Roadrunner is still going (see the vid at my link, the one of the backside is just me going down roadrunner. Only thing is, chairs 13 & 14 (Right?) aren't running, so my understanding is that anything back there would require hiking back to the main lodge?

Regarding the race camps, some of the best intermediate-level skiing is to be found around 11:00 every day when the racers take all their gates down and you can ski their still-firm courses. I'm a Mammoth noob, so I don't know all the names, but a bunch of stuff below Cornice and down to Chair 1 can be pretty fast fun.
 
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TonyC

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You may be a noob, but hitting the rope drops after the racers are done gets you the best corn groomers of the day.:golfclap:

Roadrunner continues around the backside and returns past chair 12's terrain. But the upper backside was already thin at Memorial Day so I wouldn't recommend that now. There was great corn back there Memorial weekends of 1995 and 2011, more snow back there than this year.

I did find my records from July 15, 1995. Most of the Main Lodge runs were open from St. Anton to what is now the Unbound park but chair 2 was closed. Up top I skied Drop Out and Hangman's as well as Cornice/Climax.

Most of the upper frontside had more snow this Memorial Day than in 1995, so I see lots of runs up top being skiable to mid-July.
 

Pat AKA mustski

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I skied 3 hours this morning and plan to do the same tomorrow. @green26 Tgere is still plenty of snow up top. Bob skied a bunch of the chutes today. Tony is right that anything beyond Scotty's (skiers left) will require traversing across. That said, there is a ton open for the month of June and lots of fun to be had. Too bad we will just miss you!
 

Pat AKA mustski

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Skied with @SallyCat yesterday and today. I LOVE skiing in June!
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Then we went on a walk through Twin Lakes Campground - not good. A lot of flooded out sites.


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There is still ice on Lake Mary and the Twin Falls is raging! I love the dual season!
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green26

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I skied 3 hours this morning and plan to do the same tomorrow. @green26 Tgere is still plenty of snow up top. Bob skied a bunch of the chutes today. Tony is right that anything beyond Scotty's (skiers left) will require traversing across. That said, there is a ton open for the month of June and lots of fun to be had. Too bad we will just miss you!

Thanks! It sounds great for the time of year. Will be there Friday morning til Saturday afternoon. White/orange POC helmet.
 

socalgal

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Thanks! It sounds great for the time of year. Will be there Friday morning til Saturday afternoon. White/orange POC helmet.

We're headed up tomorrow morning, o-dark-thirty. Staying for the weekend.
 

green26

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Report for Friday-Saturday June 23rd-24th: it was great for the time of year. Hangman's is still really good as is Climax, Dropout and Wipeout (accessed under the lift now). There are also some fun zipper lines that skiers have made under lift 3. Saturday at closing it started to rain penny-sized drops - we went to Wild Willy hot springs and sat in the water while it rained. Nice!
 

TonyC

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Tioga Pass opens tomorrow June 29: https://www.nps.gov/yose/learn/news/tioga-road-open-to-all-vehicular-traffic-june-29-2017.htm

Note history here also: https://www.nps.gov/yose/planyourvisit/tiogaopen.htm
This year is similar to (Tioga opening date) and not really deeper than (April 1 snowpack) the prior benchmark seasons of 1983, 1995 and 2011.

Mammoth ran until July 28 in 1983 and August 13 in 1995. Mammoth closed in July 4 in 2011, being financially conservative at that time coming out of the recession and carrying a large debt load from the Starwood deal in 2006.
 
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socalgal

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Had lots of fun Saturday and Sunday. We mostly skied till about 11. Then the slush-to-fun ratio diminished and we called it quits.

This is off the back of 3 looking towards 5 and Dry Creek. It was my first time skiing that area. 25+ days on the slopes has sure increased my comfort and ability levels.
20170625_081923.jpg


Going up 23, doing laps on Cornice.
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Goofing off. Lots b of snow still. But it was melting fast.
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Tony

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Tioga Pass opens tomorrow June 29: https://www.nps.gov/yose/learn/news/tioga-road-open-to-all-vehicular-traffic-june-29-2017.htm

Note history here also: https://www.nps.gov/yose/planyourvisit/tiogaopen.htm
This year is similar to (Tioga opening date) and not really deeper than (April 1 snowpack) the prior benchmark seasons of 1983, 1995 and 2011.

I wasn't very far off a month and a half ago when I guessed Tioga would open on 6/23 or 6/30. See post 116 on page 6 of this thread.

I wonder how long it will take Caltrans to update their website that for SR120 says "IS CLOSED FROM CRANE FLAT (TUOLUMNE CO) TO THE TUOLUMNE/MONO CO LINE /TIOGA PASS/ (TUOLUMNE CO) - FOR THE WINTER - MOTORISTS ARE ADVISED TO USE AN ALTERNATE ROUTE". Website also includes "FOR YOSEMITE NAT'L PARK ROAD INFORMATION CALL 209-372-0200" which (after pressing 1 twice) says Tioga is open.
 

Mothertucker

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Proximity warning! I prolly be around Saturday thru Monday. Gondy to summit fireworks show is sold out tho.
 
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TonyC

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Liz and I are driving Saturday, will ski July 2-5. MadPatSki (Epic screenname, not sure if he's registered here yet) from Ottawa arrived in California yesterday. He will add month 142 to his ski streak at Squaw July 1 and ski at Mammoth July 3-6. He's not skiing today because he skied June 1 at Killington.
 

TonyC

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This evening's fireworks shot off the top of chair 23, viewed from base of Stump Alley. A limited number of people bought tickets to view from the top of the gondola.
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Patrick should have been here for this on Canada's 150th anniversary.
 

TonyC

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This was expected to be the busiest day of the weekend. Lift lines at 3 and the gondola maxed about 5 minutes. The impact was more upon snow, with face of 3 and the lower race course runs getting bumpy but not sticky after 11AM. Skiing may be better the next two days with less traffic.

The severe heat wave last week has taken a toll on the snow. There are areas, notably the entire Wipe Out side of 23 out to the Paranoids, that have less snow now than at this time in 2011.
View attachment 26281
Gravity-traverse skiing extended to Paranoid 1 then but only to Scotty's now. The bottom of Wipe Out 2 is gone and the choke points of Wipe Outs 1&3 have only a few days left with some gravel in them already. All of the Wipe Outs need to be entered by traversing across Drop Out 1 unless you want to walk over some gravel. Hangman's looks wider than 2011 but there are rocks in its throat that you may need to slide over carefully.

That said, skier packed lines off the top are excellent, fairly obvious examples in this pic.
View attachment 26281
Snow that has not been skied much is severely suncupped. This is normal for July but was much less in evidence in 2011. This was particularly surprising to me on the chair 5 terrain because the lift is still running for Shaun White's freestyle camp. There are narrow skier-packed lines down Upper Dry Creek, Sliver and Face of 5, but the rest is suncupped fairly heavily while it was overall fairly smooth July 1-4 in 2011.

The areas with more snow than 2011 IMHO are face of 3 and Gremlin's/World Cup/St. Anton. Some of this is due to deposition from avalanches during the big January/February storms. These are the core areas of the mountain needing to be snow covered for skiing to last another month. The stairway into McCoy Station is still half buried, though the 18-foot sign on the top of the mountain is completely exposed. Eventually you will be walking down some dirt to get to the top of Cornice, as that run is already about half normal width. Climax is loaded with snow and should last to whenever closing is.

Main Lodge probably has more snow than 2011, should last another week or two as it did in 1995.
View attachment 26281

I still think it is very likely chairs 2 and 23 will close after July 4.

I am not able to add pics in edit mode. I made a second post, cut and pasted the pics into this one. But then when I cleared the redundant post, the pics disappeared from this one.
 
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