Meet Alterra Mountain Company

[LKLA]

Because Aspen has been part of 'Epic-competitive' pass products before and their choice not to be so, within this tier of resorts and access, is ...unexpected to some. if they continue being part of a pass product, one can only imagine that they wish to control their fate to be limited access within a multi-tier ecosystem.



We understand the mechanism - but the mechanism of how to justify not doing something is not the reason why.one doesn't do something.

How exactly would you propose they justify adding something that they do NOT own?

Alterra has a minority shareholder who does happen to own Aspen but that does not mean much, which is why Aspen was always doubted to be included in any kind of multi-mountain pass.

Perhaps someone needs to review the mechanisms before telling others to do so

 

[LKLA]

They've always said that the Aspen mountains were NOT a part of the KSL/Henry Crown conglomerate so not sure why that would be a surprise.

I would be interested in seeing a Copper/Eldora/Loveland or Copper/Eldora/Loveland/Abasin pass if Copper/Eldora are shut out from the RMSP+ replacement. A girl can dream.

Yes, neither KSL nor Crown nor Aspen ever said that any of the four Aspen mountains would be included. No one I've spoken to who works in the ski industry was surprised at the news - other than at the rather horrific name.

 

[Nathanvg]

Seems like we are jumping to conclusions based on a very vague press release. The press release announced the name and confirmed the ski areas in the group. All other details are speculation from a souce other than Alterra. We should have details in about a month so they can sell them this season for redemption next year.

 

[LKLA]

Seems like we are jumping to conclusions based on a very vague press release. The press release announced the name and confirmed the ski areas in the group. All other details are speculation from a souce other than Alterra. We should have details in about a month so they can sell them this season for redemption next year.

From the press release:

In the coming months Alterra Mountain Company will announce new season pass products that will provide access to all of our existing mountains, plus many additional benefits, sure to please skiers and riders.

 

[Jilly]

So, maybe a limited number of days at the Aspens.....we can hope.

 

[Muleski]

I'd tap the brakes a bit with respect to ANY thought that they are close to finalizing pass plans for 2018-2019.
There are ways to co-market with the four Aspen SkiCo properties, should that make sense to both entities.

Notice the emphasis on individual "Premium" {aka high end} Destination Resorts. No doubt there will be a pass offering across all of the properties. I suspect, based on what I'm told, that the competition with Epic will be based on the breadth of the properties. The quality of the experience is likely to be planned to blow most of VR away, eventually.

I'm sure that, ss has been the case all along, the mainstream and ski press is jumping the gun and reading into this as being a pass and price war. That will amaze me. They are talking top quality.

As somebody heavily involved in this told me a couple of years ago: "When was the last time you associated best in class, gold standard quality with the lowest price?"

That has stuck with me. Not looking to Alterra to be competing on price. In some markets, perhaps. I doubt of the price passes will be the same, everywhere. You may have a "home " season pass, and a uniform add on price to add access to the other 11.

Many ways for this to unfold......

As I said when the deal was first announced, this has a long way to go. Anybody thought of which of those properties may be sold before next season, and of others that may be acquired?

I'm not running out looking to buy my Alterra pass, quite yet. I may be all wet on this, for sure.

 

[cantunamunch]

How exactly would you propose they justify adding something that they do NOT own?

I don't propose they justify anything. And never did.

Alterra has a minority shareholder who does happen to own Aspen

Yup, got it first time.

, which is why Aspen was always doubted to be included in any kind of multi-mountain pass.

Other than the multi-mountain pass product those mountains are currently in...

I'd tap the brakes a bit with respect to ANY thought that they are close to finalizing pass plans for 2018-2019.
There are ways to co-market with the four Aspen SkiCo properties, should that make sense to both entities.

Notice the emphasis on individual "Premium" {aka high end} Destination Resorts. No doubt there will be a pass offering across all of the properties.

Completely agreed - As I said above I strongly suspect there will be a multi tier ecosystem.

 

[Tricia]

We've been spending the past few days at Deer Valley for the Freestyle World Cup.
People around here are optimistic about the future. More on that later. For now, I'm getting ready to go back out to watch moguls in the cool night air.

 

[Nathanvg]

From the press release:

In the coming months Alterra Mountain Company will announce new season pass products that will provide access to all of our existing mountains, plus many additional benefits, sure to please skiers and riders.

That can mean just about anything. "Access" could be unlimited access to all 12 or a small discount. Additional benefits could include all MCP benefits or just a small discount on food at the 12.

 

[Jilly]

Alterra Mountain Company is made up of unique mountain destinations, each with a personality and spirit that has delighted visitors for generations. Our vision at Alterra Mountain Company is to protect and enhance what makes each destination special, inviting guests back to their favorite mountain, and enticing them to visit new destinations on their bucket list,” said David Perry, President and COO, Alterra Mountain Company. “We respect and continue to learn from the pioneers and leaders that built these iconic locations and paved the way before us, as we push the boundaries and innovate for our future.”

This paragraph...."enticing them to visit new destinations on their bucket list" We can hope!!

 

[fatbob]

Hmm I've just seen someone else describe it as Squaw, Mammoth and a bunch of B grade resorts in each state. Deer Valley no doubt up for debate but it doesn't get the ski blood pumping like a name like Alta or Jackson Hole.

 

[Jilly]

So, I ski a B grade resort that has been the "best in east" for many years....It can be improved...trust me!!

 

[Muleski]

They are at the beginning. The resort portfolio is going to change. Bet on it.

BTW, I would not really consider CMH, Steamboat {which has rabid fans}, let alone Tremblant to be "B grade". I think that assessment is a bit off base.

Jackson Hole, privately held. Sun Valley? Rumore t be on the block {at the right price} for some time. The entire portfolio of Och-Ziff? Lots of chatter there. Each individual property could be peeled off. Some of those operated by Boyne? More operators in Canada, and Europe. NZ?

KSL has a huge war chest. These folks know the business. I said this when the deal first was being talked about, Stay tuned. This is all about high end destination resorts. Not about feeder hills, etc. They are not going to follow the Vail model. Or so they tell their investors.

They are not cobbling this thing together, long term with resorts that did nothing for Intrawest. They have a huge amount of cash to work with, and seemingly a long line of investors who want in every time they open another fund. It's startling how fast they raise money.

Some of that money will go into some of the current resorts. Some will be sold. Others will acquired.

 

[Tricia]

Seems like we are jumping to conclusions based on a very vague press release. The press release announced the name and confirmed the ski areas in the group. All other details are speculation from a souce other than Alterra. We should have details in about a month so they can sell them this season for redemption next year.

I'd tap the brakes a bit

They are at the beginning. The resort portfolio is going to change. Bet on it.

This^^^
There is more than meets the eye. I see some interesting things happening in the coming months.

Hmm I've just seen someone else describe it as Squaw, Mammoth and a bunch of B grade resorts in each state. Deer Valley no doubt up for debate but it doesn't get the ski blood pumping like a name like Alta or Jackson Hole.

I've been skiing Deer Valley the past few days. IMHO its a very underrated mountain. Its not all about the groomers, trust me.

 

[mdf]

On the website, if you tap one of the mountains it changes the background to video from that mountain.

 

[Philpug]

IMHO this is a great time for the ski resort landscape and the consumer. In one corner, we have Vail who is catering to people who ski and look like they are working on the volume model. Get them in the door with cheap pass deals and get them to buy $800 ski lessons, $18.00 Epic burgers and $6.75 Hot Chocolates while minimizing the output in salaries. Alterra (guessing based upon the players) will build a competitive pass model that actually cater's to skiers and not just people who ski. Lesson & food pricing will be on the higher side but you will get what you pay for. Talking to people who work at the Aspens and even Deer Valley say there are few better organizations. We will see this as a simple quantity vs. quality model.

Now what happens to the other players? This is the $64K question. IMHG, we will see these indpendant mountains have no choice but to band together. It will take some organization but with the right leadership, they will figure it out. Maybe a Tim Petrick comes in or a Andy Wirth leave KSL to take the challenge bit I think these independents could be the fly in the ointment to these conglomerates and disrupt the global domination plans. If done right, they could have everything to gain...with little to lose.

 

[Muleski]

Very, very interesting times. As much as we have seen take place in the past couple of years, my jungle telegraph is telling me to keep my eyes and ears open and stay tuned.

I agree with @Philpug. There could be a lot of opportunity for many. I hope that we see small local areas hold on. Different than the independents coming together, but another challenge.

This past weekend we caught up with a friend who was pretty heavily involved in American Skiing Co. Previously had not worked in the biz. One coment that he made was that he had always thought they should have been able to realize a lot more economies of scale. They did, but not many. In fact they acted like the 800 lb. gorilla, and had more that a few suppliers shut them off.

What excites me most about Alterra is that these are smart people who know the industry. This is not a public company. No stockholders. No quarterly earnings. No EPS. It's logical to me.

And at the same time, I hope a lot of smart independents are coming together to discuss how best to play in this new world.

I have to agree, it's a good time to be a skier!

 

[New2]

Hmm I've just seen someone else describe it as Squaw, Mammoth and a bunch of B grade resorts in each state. Deer Valley no doubt up for debate but it doesn't get the ski blood pumping like a name like Alta or Jackson Hole.

I don't think Alterra's primary goal is to "get the ski blood pumping" so much as to make money. And my impression is that Deer Valley and Steamboat, at least, are better money-makers than Squaw or Mammoth. A real challenge is that wealthy expert skiers is a pretty small pool--I'm not at all sure it makes sense for them to spend a whole lot chasing that particular market.

They are at the beginning. The resort portfolio is going to change. Bet on it...

Jackson Hole, privately held. Sun Valley? Rumore t be on the block {at the right price} for some time. The entire portfolio of Och-Ziff? Lots of chatter there. Each individual property could be peeled off. Some of those operated by Boyne? More operators in Canada, and Europe. NZ?

My guess is that the Holding heirs would be willing to sell both Snowbasin and Sun Valley--and both would make great additions to the Alterra portfolio... could be the shot in the arm Snowbasin needs to get their real estate going. It wouldn't surprise me to see Telluride in play, too... Chuck Horning's in his seventies I think and might be thinking about next steps.

KSL has a huge war chest. These folks know the business. I said this when the deal first was being talked about, Stay tuned. This is all about high end destination resorts. Not about feeder hills, etc.

What does Vail tell their investors? Seems like "This is all about high end destination resorts. Not about feeder hills, etc." would fit the bill there, too. It seems to me that there's room in a destination-focused company to have some feeder hills, too. California in particular... if Alterra sells off the Big Bear resorts, it seems like it would be a lot harder to get significant loyalty among southern California's well-to-do skiers. I suspect they'll sell June and Winter Park if they can find buyers at the right price (June in particular will be hard to unload, though). Stratton, Blue, and Snowshoe, I just don't know enough about them to say... maybe. But I think they hang onto the other 9 areas.​

 

[peterm]

I agree the name is a bit blah. They might name the pass something else though, in the same way that Vail's pass isn't called the Vail Pass.

It'll be interesting to see what the pricing of their "all resorts, all you can eat" pass is. I speculated about a premium competitor to the Epic Pass in a previous thread, and fully expect it to play out that way. Fully loaded Epic Pass is approx. $850, and I doubt the Alterra equivalent will be under $1000. To push it much past that I suspect they'll need have to throw in some days at the Aspen resorts. Also, Vail has a real jewel in Whistler which also gives them a hedge against poor US conditions - a factor that has only been magnified of late. So Alterra really needs a resort in Western Canada (would tie in nicely with CMH too), and a good one at that. Any predictions?

 

[tball]

What excites me most about Alterra is that these are smart people who know the industry. This is not a public company. No stockholders. No quarterly earnings. No EPS. It's logical to me.

From your posts, it also sounds like primarily equity financing rather than debt. If so, that's fantastic for these beloved resorts and the industry. Thanks for your insights.