Marker announces new GripWalk Partners

[Brian Finch]

I don't see where I am getting milked or incurring any additional expense....unless I rush out and go gripwalk right away and start buying new bindings, which I won't do.

+1 I actually think GripWalk makes the longevity, hand me down & resale stock increased if you can readily ‘re-sole’ the boot. The trouble to this point has been sourcing the particular toe/heel plates- however Nordica /Tecnica have done a great job making sole kits, buckles & even liners available right on their sites.

 

[wallyk]

It's obviously here to stay, but to me it seems like a way to milk us more than anything else, it obsoletes tons of bindings, it makes skiing marginally worse, and it makes walking marginally better. It's not like it turns your ski boots into a pair of crocs. I just don't think it improves things nearly enough to be worth the hassle, But it's here, it's not going anywhere and I guess I'll live with it.

The point about making current bindings obsolete is what concerns me the most. I have don't have a dog in the fight either way, but I don't like the idea of having to replace equipment to accommodate a slight change in how ski boots are supposed to walk. Ski boots are for exactly that. Skiing. I understand that many people do walk from their vehicle of the lodge/ski lift, but what's wrong with having to change the screw-in soles occasionally? Replacing boot soles rather than bindings is a heckova lot more affordable than having to repair bindings.

My current Lange RX120's are 6 years old, fit like a glove and I ski in them. I replaced one worn heel pad and otherwise they are fine. I get ill nauseous about the thought of changing bindings so I can walk better.........

 

[BMC]

I'm sure Pugski can correct me, but I understand skiing has a 10% return rate. In other words, only one in 10 newbies come back to do it again. Given skiing is the best recreational activity on earth that you do clothed in the outdoors, that's ridiculously low.

Frankly, I think the industry committed an enormous own goal when they talked rear entry boots into oblivion. Uncommitted recreational skiers couldn't care less whether their boots are the ultimate in performance, but for reasons that I'm sure are clear to someone the industry, they killed them off and in doing so made it that much harder to get uncommitted new skiers to return (because they complain ski boots are hard to put on and take off, uncomfortable to wear, and hard to walk in). WTR and Grip Walk dont make boots easier to put on or more comfortable, but they do make them easier to walk in.

So I think moves to make ski boots easier to walk in is a completely sensible path, removing one impediment to keeping the less committed skier in the sport/lifestyle.

I haven't used GripWalk but WTR is basically a half way house between Alpine soles and AT soles, with the safety of a normal Alpine sole, and I'm familiar with WTR. For all but the committed long tour AT skier I think Grip Walk is a sensible choice for expert skiers doing a bit of resort skiing, a bit of hiking and/or sidecountry, assuming it is similar to WTR (and I believe it is).

The transition to a new norm will always be painful. In any event, Alpine soles will continue, so it's not like old bindings will become obsolete. Some of them just can't be used with GW bindings.

I think long term GW (or WTR) is better for 90% if skiers.

I do have one pair of bindings which won't be able to be used with GW soles but that's a problem for when I get new boots, which will be at least 4-5 years away, minimum.

 

[Philpug]

I'm sure Pugski can correct me, but I understand skiing has a 10% return rate. In other words, only one in 10 newbies come back to do it again. Given skiing is the best recreational activity on earth that you do clothed in the outdoors, that's ridiculously low.

I am not sure 10% is the number but it is low. If the ability to walk from the base to the lift the problem, is an easy walking sole be better? It will not move the needle one iota IMHO. Of the top 10 reasons that the return rate is so low...GripWalk doesn't break the top 25. GripWalk is not skiing savior. Do I like a GW sole, yes. Would I stop skiing or miss it if it was short lived and was faded out tomorrow? Not a chance. But it is the wrong answer to why the return rate is so low.

 

[BMC]

I am not sure 10% is the number but it is low. If the ability to walk from the base to the lift the problem, is an easy walking sole be better? It will not move the needle one iota IMHO. Of the top 10 reasons that the return rate is so low...GripWalk doesn't break the top 25. GripWalk is not skiing savior. Do I like a GW sole, yes. Would I stop skiing or miss it if it was short lived and was faded out tomorrow? Not a chance. But it is the wrong answer to why the return rate is so low.

I don’t think easier walking is a solution in itself, but it’s one step amongst many other possible steps to make our fantastic sport/lifestyle more attractive to the less committed skier.

I do personally think reintroduction of a good rear entry boot for rental fleets modelled on a good boot like Salomon’s, perhaps improved to take into account modern developments, would help greatly.

What else could be done I’m not sure

 

[Philpug]

I don’t think easier walking is a solution in itself, but it’s one step amongst many other possible steps to make our fantastic sport/lifestyle more attractive to the less committed skier.

I do personally think reintroduction of a good rear entry boot for rental fleets modelled on a good boot like Salomon’s, perhaps improved to take into account modern developments, would help greatly.

What else could be done I’m not sure

Make the sport more accessable cost wise wi tthe beginners. $99 packages that include lift/lessons/rentals/lunch. Not just by the feeder hills but by the Vail's of the industry. The most important customer to the sport is the newest but resorts continue to put that person in the hands of their least qualified and lowest paid employee from the very beginning in rentals and instruction. These people need to be welcomed into the sport by the most qualified and most experienced. Get the people hooked to the sport right, look at the drug industry, het them hooked with free samples. Have the beginner area access free. Run free morning lessons. Have Instructors available on the bringer terrain. There are so many things that need to be done to retain people that are more important than a walking sole. I will say though this sole will cut down on base area falls, that are indeed dangerous and most of the injuries go unreported but lets get work on keeping the 90% who ski only once. And yes, a good solid rear entry boot, that actually fits a foot, could go a long way.

 

[A-A-Ron]

Hello Everyone!

Is this transition from WTR to GripWalk going to be 100% in effect in 2018/19 season for ski boots, such as the 18/19's Atomic Hawk XTD 130's? Looking to find out if someone can confirm when the transition will happen for boots (not just a speculative guess). I have yet to get ahold of the local rep or anyone else that can confirm.

 

[Philpug]

Hello Everyone!

Is this transition from WTR to GripWalk going to be 100% in effect in 2018/19 season for ski boots, such as the 18/19's Atomic Hawk XTD 130's? Looking to find out if someone can confirm when the transition will happen for boots (not just a speculative guess). I have yet to get ahold of the local rep or anyone else that can confirm.

Not 100% by any means maybe not even 50% but we will see more for sure. I will take a look at the Atomic catalog later but I don't recall that the XTD will have a GripWalk sole but more likely a WTR one yet, but I will confirm later.

 

[A-A-Ron]

Not 100% by any means maybe not even 50% but we will see more for sure. I will take a look at the Atomic catalog later but I don't recall that the XTD will have a GripWalk sole but more likely a WTR one yet, but I will confirm later.

Cool, thanks! I did find a 2018/19 Atomic catalog online the other day, but the print was so small and then blurry when I attempted to enlarge, that I could not tell what was going on with the 18/19 XTD's. I really wish they would just change this line for next season, but I get it if they cannot -- I'm sure it's difficult for them to make a quick transition on all of their established products.

 

[Blacklab]

Not yet. I will ask if there is one on the way...They will need one for all the Pivot 15's they are going to sell when they reintroduce it....maybe at the same time??? #bringbackthe15

Any updates on when/if Look is going to make a new AFD for P18's? Also, is it as simple as just swapping the AFD on the P18 like it was for WTR? No other tweaks would be needed?

 

[Philpug]

Any updates on when/if Look is going to make a new AFD for P18's? Also, is it as simple as just swapping the AFD on the P18 like it was for WTR? No other tweaks would be needed?

No update, just the DIN/Alpine one and the WTR option at this point.

 

[Marker]

Two questions:

• Does Gripwalk in and of itself represent (theoretically) a higher risk of ACL rupture or other injuries, such as leg or ankle fractures?
  
• How likely is it that either KneeBinding or the Howell binding will become Gripwalk compatible?

I currently use Lange RS130 and don't expect to need new boots for a few years. My current bindings are Pivots and Axial 3, but contemplating future ski purchases after my fibula fracture this season.

 

[Blacklab]

No update, just the DIN/Alpine one and the WTR option at this point.

Thanks. Maybe we'll just have to wait until the offerings come out for the '19-'20 season.

 

[dcpnz]

Since this thread started with announcing Atomic and Salomon are on board with Grip Walk is there any word (official or unofficial) on the binding front from them. Specifically:
1) Can/Will Sth2 be retroactively certified for Grip Walk?
2) Or will we see a STH3?
3) Or is their solution MNC via Warden and Shift?

 

[A-A-Ron]

Not 100% by any means maybe not even 50% but we will see more for sure. I will take a look at the Atomic catalog later but I don't recall that the XTD will have a GripWalk sole but more likely a WTR one yet, but I will confirm later.

Cool, thanks! I did find a 2018/19 Atomic catalog online the other day, but the print was so small and then blurry when I attempted to enlarge, that I could not tell what was going on with the 18/19 XTD's. I really wish they would just change this line for next season, but I get it if they cannot -- I'm sure it's difficult for them to make a quick transition on all of their established products.

I had a discussion with an Atomic rep over the weekend regarding what he knows about the company's boot plans. He noted that the XTD's boots will remain WTR for 18/19, and perhaps in 19/20 as well, the latter pretty uncertain.

 

[A-A-Ron]

Two questions:

• Does Gripwalk in and of itself represent (theoretically) a higher risk of ACL rupture or other injuries, such as leg or ankle fractures?
  
• How likely is it that either KneeBinding or the Howell binding will become Gripwalk compatible?

Regarding injury risk, GripWalk includes an AFD interface on the sole blocks, so let's hope there is not an increased risk.

Regarding Howell Ski Bindings and KneeBinding . . . Howell is just getting off the ground with his new product, with plans to release in 2019, so is not likely overly concerned with addressing a new standard at this time. Howell, wisely, will research the heck out of GripWalk before even considering it. If GripWalk takes over the consumer market, which looks like a very strong possibility, he will certainly need to keep the standard in mind.
KneeBinding seems a bit slow to update on things, and who knows how much RnD they are putting into new products nowadays. Their website is in need of an update. KneeBinding is poorly marketed and is not reaching people looking for the "cool factor", which would likely be tough for them to do even if they were marketing their product optimally. Again, with a strong possibility of GripWalk taking over the consumer market, KneeBinding will also need to keep GripWalk in mind. Their market share is already small, and they could lose a lot if skiers chose GripWalk over our older established standard.

It would be interesting if Howell or KneeBinding sold to a large manufacture or licensed their technology, but I'll leave such discussions to more applicable threads.

 

[Erik Timmerman]

Today's experiment. I got DIN soles for my Fischer Ranger Free 130s. I replaced the soles on one foot and spent the day skiing with one Gripwalk and one DIN sole. There was very little difference walking I wasn't tripping and didn't feel like I had developed a limp. Nobody was like "hey, what's wrong with your leg". Skiing, there absolutely is a difference. It felt like the Gripwalk ski had an extra degree of base bevel. Very noticeable first thing in the morning on hard snow, in the afternoon (it was 50 degrees today) there was no discernible difference between the two.

 

[cantunamunch]

Any noticeable damping difference in the Gripwalk sole?

I can just see it now The Return of Zero Base Bevel...

 

[Erik Timmerman]

Any noticeable damping difference in the Gripwalk sole?

I can just see it now The Return of Zero Base Bevel...

Damping? Do you mean walking or skiing? Walking definitely, the DIN soles I could feel the sand and gravel crunching more under foot. Skiing, I don't think so although Gripwalk felt softer when I was clicking in to the binding.

 

[cantunamunch]

I was asking about skiing; the walking bit might be of interest to some here with arthritic knees.