Help me decide: Armada ARV 96 vs ARW 96, and length

[Monique]

Nooooo, not in a PM

OMG. You need to go ski somewhere pronto so that you have something better to entertain you than the minutiae of my mount point!

 

[Started at 53]

I am entertaining myself.

I go to work tomorrow tho, so you will be safe soon.

I will be RIPPING up the bunny slopes at Deer Valley starting Dec 12th

 

[Monique]

I am entertaining myself.

I go to work tomorrow tho, so you will be safe soon.

Hmmm.

You know, there's skiing here in Colorado right now ... it's not amazing, but it's there ...

 

[Started at 53]

Hmmm.

You know, there's skiing here in Colorado right now ... it's not amazing, but it's there ...

I know, you guys are killing me, but I am working starting tomorrow Wed-Sat the next three weeks, then we are at DV for 12 days

 

[Ken_R]

It might seem obvious but I would start with the ski exactly as you demoed it. Usually with skis with tail rocker you do not want to go further back anyway. That said, mounting a demo binding is the right call.

I agree that it is best to err on the short side of ski length given your priorities (Knee Comfort and Ease) since you do not plan on charging hard down steep slopes with variable snow anyway. When your skiing and fitness changes then you might want to start looking at other skis.

 

[Monique]

I know, you guys are killing me, but I am working starting tomorrow Wed-Sat the next three weeks, then we are at DV for 12 days

Acceptable.

 

[Monique]

It might seem obvious but I would start with the ski exactly as you demoed it. Usually with skis with tail rocker you do not want to go further back anyway. That said, mounting a demo binding is the right call.

I agree that it is best to err on the short side of ski length given your priorities (Knee Comfort and Ease) since you do not plan on charging hard down steep slopes with variable snow anyway. When your skiing and fitness changes then you might want to start looking at other skis.

I don't technically know for sure it was center mounted - that's just an educated guess. I didn't think to look or ask. But it probably was.

I do plan to ski plenty of steeps with variable snow - but since I tend to "hang on" to the turn and lean into the mountain, probably not so much hard charging. But I would like to develop a much more aggressive - sorry, *committed* - approach. I had that commitment down pat right when I blew up a year and a half ago ... maybe commitment can be overdone.

 

[GregK]

Thought you knew for sure it on the more centered(-2.5 back from center) position when you tried it which I thought was odd as Armada AVR are always mounted -5cm back if they know the person is using them all mountain. For your use, that’s where they should be mounted and probably were. They just look way more center mounted as regular skis are usually in the -10/-12cm back range or so. They NEVER would have mounted a non symmetrical ski right on the center unless the person skis nothing but rails in the park and requested it.

If you want to put a demo binding on it, mount for about -4cm or -5cm back (Armada all mountain line)so you could try a bit forward or back.

Pretty much every twin tip on the market works best around -4cm to -6cm if used all mountain. Only center mount if the ski is a symmetrical twin designed for park skiing. Park rail/skiing/lots of switch skiing about -2cm back, Park/all mountain -3/-4cm back, all mountain -4 to -6cm.

I have 7 pairs of twin tips and they are all from -3cm to -4cm back from center as I ski park/all mountain.

-5 cm back is where you want to be and probably where it was when you tried them.

 

[Monique]

Thought you knew for sure it on the more centered(-2.5 back from center) position when you tried it which I thought was odd as Armada AVR are always mounted -5cm back if they know the person is using them all mountain. For your use, that’s where they should be mounted and probably were. They just look way more center mounted as regular skis are usually in the -10/-12cm back range or so. They NEVER would have mounted a non symmetrical ski right on the center unless the person skis nothing but rails in the park and requested it.

If you want to put a demo binding on it, mount for about -4cm or -5cm back (Armada all mountain line)so you could try a bit forward or back.

Pretty much every twin tip on the market works best around -4cm to -6cm if used all mountain. Only center mount if the ski is a symmetrical twin designed for park skiing. Park rail/skiing/lots of switch skiing about -2cm back, Park/all mountain -3/-4cm back, all mountain -4 to -6cm.

I have 7 pairs of twin tips and they are all from -3cm to -4cm back from center as I ski park/all mountain.

-5 cm back is where you want to be and probably where it was when you tried them.

Agh. Now my head hurts. Is there any way to find out what they actually would have done? When I called the rep, he wasn't sure, assumed center.

 

[GregK]

Honestly, I’d be SHOCKED if it were anywhere but the -5cm/all mountain mounting point when you tried them.

If you had baggy pants and said you wanted to “try these in the park” and “see what they are like skiing switch/backwards”, then they would have put them at the -2.5/park setting. Lol

-5cm is where they were and where they should be for all mountain use like you are using them for.

 

[GregK]

Look at all my skis in my profile pic. They all “look centered” but most are around -4cm back from center. Sure the Armada’s were -5cm back.

 

[Monique]

Okay, then, on your head be it, and I'll just order a "regular" binding from @SkiEssentials , saving some money and supporting the "local" shop.

I mean, if I hate it, it's a big enough difference that I can just remount them, right?

 

[GregK]

Yes, you can always remount but don’t think you’ll need to and “regular” bindings will be cheaper and lighter. Attack 13’s would be highly recommended as they are great bindings for the money. Light, durable and a great value.

 

[Monique]

Yes, you can always remount but don’t think you’ll need to and “regular” bindings will be cheaper and lighter. Attack 13’s would be highly recommended as they are great bindings for the money. Light, durable and a great value.

Oh, yeah. Note I didn't ask which bindings to choose. I love Attack 13s, and they're easy to step into. Especially important right now.

 

[GregK]

At least you have one easy choice then for bindings! Haha

 

[Monique]

At least you have one easy choice then for bindings! Haha

No kidding!

After a particularly disastrous run in upside down snow where, every time I found my ski, I needed someone to help me get back in them again - I replaced my Markers with Attack 13s and haven't looked back. When I was cleared to ski last season, I honestly could not have stepped into most bindings, either. The Attack 13 was gentle enough that I could do it.

 

[Monique]

FWIW, I called Armada again, just to be sure. The very nice rep (Trevor) actually contacted the tech from the demo tent (MacKenzie) and verified that the mount was traditional, not center.

Talk about some serious customer service.

 

[GregK]

Still waiting to find out where I pick up the prize for knowing where they would have mounted the skis for you.........Haha!

Armada calls their All Mountain binding mount line "Factory Recommended" which is at the -5cm back from center and the Park mount line is called "Secondary Mount Position" which is -2.5cm back from center on the ARV series. On their dedicated park skis there is sometimes just one "Factory Recommended" line at -2.5cm and on their more traditional skis like the Tracer etc., there is again just one "Factory Recommended" line which is in the -10cm back from center range.

When you get into the -8/-10cm or further back range, this gets into the "Traditional mount" range because this is the range where traditional, non twin tip skis are mounted so you might confuse your shop tech if you ask for a "Traditional mount" on a twin tip. For most twin tips it's all about Park(Center to -2.5cm back) or All Mountain(-4 to -6cm back) and the percentage of Park vs All Mountain use will determine where you mount the skis between the 0 to -6cm range. Armada ARV/Head Flight/Faction CT series chooses -5cm as their All Mountain use mounting point and J Skis and a few others choose -6cm back for their All Mountain twins.

 

[Monique]

Still waiting to find out where I pick up the prize for knowing where they would have mounted the skis for you.........Haha!

Armada calls their All Mountain binding mount line "Factory Recommended" which is at the -5cm back from center and the Park mount line is called "Secondary Mount Position" which is -2.5cm back from center on the ARV series. On their dedicated park skis there is sometimes just one "Factory Recommended" line at -2.5cm and on their more traditional skis like the Tracer etc., there is again just one "Factory Recommended" line which is in the -10cm back from center range.

When you get into the -8/-10cm or further back range, this gets into the "Traditional mount" range because this is the range where traditional, non twin tip skis are mounted so you might confuse your shop tech if you ask for a "Traditional mount" on a twin tip. For most twin tips it's all about Park(Center to -2.5cm back) or All Mountain(-4 to -6cm back) and the percentage of Park vs All Mountain use will determine where you mount the skis between the 0 to -6cm range. Armada ARV/Head Flight/Faction CT series chooses -5cm as their All Mountain use mounting point and J Skis and a few others choose -6cm back for their All Mountain twins.

So, I should just ask for the all mountain mount point, then. Right?

 

[GregK]

Correct! All-Mountain mount/Factory Recommended(-5cm) is what you skied and what you ask for when you get them mounted. There are 2 lines on Armada twin tips and you want the one closer to the tail.