Doping allegations and the Olympics

[Started at 53]

I guess you should be advising WADA.

@Swede
I am interested to know if that was directed towards me? You see I am somewhat active in a now Olympic sport and have pretty high knowledge of another as well as friends with former physiotherapists from the cycling world. So I would say I have a bit of a handle on things. I had to learn a lot about WADA prior to the Rio Olympics. Sorry, but I am not big on trust, but I am HUGE on verify.

If you dance, ya gotta pay the band.

As for "advising WADA", I'm pretty sure I could not/would not want to take the pay cut.

 

[Swede]

Yes it was. I was called up on for stating the facts in this specific case. To make sweeping arguments about doping and how it us used (even if correct in some cases) is confusing and borderline dishonest accusations.
The "experts" which is not only the jury, but competing athletes in the Nordic countries as well as reporters who have studied this case closely all agree that it was a fair judgment. And no one is putting on silk gloves or giving her a slack because she's s star over here. Finns and Swedes are quick to critisize the Norwegians when ever they can.
And given the fact that Ms Johaug got 18 months and not three or four years clearly show that there is no doubt from the gathered expertise (media, athletes and coaches as well as WADA) that this was not a cover up scheme for a systematic doping program to gain physical advantage. It was a dumb ass mistake. And she'll be missing two seasons including an Olympic game due to it.

 

[Eleeski]

The primary criteria should be the health of the athlete. Level playing fields, sanctity of the sport, history or whatever drives WADA policy is secondary.

I saw what her lip looked like when she used the closterbol balm, and ... I can imagine that she just wanted the baddest mf of lip balms available. It looked horrible. Not an expert at all on doping, but according to news over here levels of closterbol was very low (I guess that's why her story was found credible by the international jury). Everyone on the sport news seemed to agree it wasn't anything that could've enhanced her performance

Having someone suffer with a treatable condition that WADA prohibits seems insensitive, pompous and unhealthy.

I'm not a fan of WADA. I signed on to their code for a senior world tournament. The list is confusing (beyond my normal doctors) as is the TUE process (I went through it). Normal treatments for common ailments violate their rules. So I was not able to follow the proper medical procedures for an injury/illness. Steroids are first line treatments for shingles - which were restricted in deference to the WADA rules. A horrible case of shingles combined with an injured hip filled the hip with calcium. At least WADA allows the titanium hip I now have.

Maybe my hip is cheating - Floyd Landis has the same hip. Or maybe he paved the way for other athletes to become healthy. I thank him.

Eric

PS I scared my son away from PEDs by connecting Lance's testicular cancer to steroid use (it was a good story). It's all about the health of the athletes.

 

[Primoz]

There's few things. First, it's Sundby's case. He tested positive twice and basically all this was covered up by FIS and NSF. Once it really came out he got 2 months ban during summer. Well you know, August and September are months with most of races in xc ski racing, so that ban really hit him hard. Few months later Johaug tests positive for steroids, which should automatically grant 4 years ban. NFS and Norwqegian sports fed. first issue 2 month provisional ban and everyone jump up. Mostly because how they handled (and covered up Sundby's case earlier), so on the end she got 13 months, which would cost her one season but make it perfectly possible for her to be back at Olympics (probably winning everything). And due all the bad press FIS got on Sundby's case, I believe they decided to show they don't let Norwegians do whatever they want, so they went to appeal.
Now is she really guilty or not? I guess there's no doubt. That "innocent" lip balm has huge doping warning sticker on box. I mean you can be blind and you still can't miss it (check this and think you are team doctor or pro athlete who knows what you should take care of, and then tell you didn't know it could be problematic https://goo.gl/8v2YAE ). Was it really just this or is this coverup for something else is left open. Levels in her samples were low, but nowadays noone is going for huge doses anyway, so low levels can be anything... really just lip balsam or "normal" microdosing doping stuff. And imagining these guys are clean is simply naive. So in my mind, 18 months is actually once again double standards which are so common in today's joke of anti-doping system. If she would be from anywhere else then Norway (especially if she would be from Russia), I'm pretty sure we would be talking now about how easy some dirty doper got away.

 

[oldschoolskier]

When I was competing in the late 80's thru mid 90's each country published its own drug hand book of allowed and not allowed drugs.

My son is now at the competitive stage where drug testing occures both at meets and at random by the national sport organization, i.e. they can show up at your home or training facility and ask for a sample. (Added..he takes anti-seizure meds, so there is a risk).

To look up what drugs are now ok or not ok, it done on internet and covers drugs that have DIN numbers and a linked to the country sold.

Here is one of the methods to do so

http://www.globaldro.com/Home

If you are at this level protect yourself as in most cases your country has invested in you at this point and part of that investment is making you aware of the drug issues. I've been to enough training development camps to know that they touch on this and many other topics to ensure athlete awareness. Some choose to ignorant and ignore the teachings. Sucks to be them.

 

[Lauren]

Everyone also agreed it was tough, but fair.

This sums up my thoughts on the incident pretty well. In my eyes, there was a line that was crossed...a very clear line...you either test positive or you don't. Now, the amount found in your system, and the length of your suspension is where there's a grey area. I think this will *hopefully* bring more attention to athletes to take a little additional personal responsibility and understand what they're getting before they take it.

 

[Jack skis]

Meanwhile, here's an example of how the NFL handles PEDs: "LA Chargers center Max Tuerk was suspended by the league for the first four games of the regular season for violating its policy on performance enhancing substances." Sure different than the way skiing handles drug use. I have no opinion on which method makes more sense.

The quote was from Seattle Times, Wednesday, August 23, 2017.

 

[Primoz]

Sure different than the way skiing handles drug use.

Not so much different when you know how things are going on in background in skiing FIS or any other federation, including WADA, are anything but so clean, strict and rules respecting organizations as they might see on outside.

 

[quant]

This is nothing. The new IOC rules were changed so there is now no sex testing or testosterone limits. Will we see "Bodette" Miller race in the women's DH at the PyeongChang 2018 Winter Olympics? Someone is going to take advantage of the new politically correct rules, yet a female athlete is banned for her lip balm (she should have known better). Amazing.
http://dailycaller.com/2017/07/03/heres-what-the-2018-olympic-gender-regulations-look-like/