Anyone ski both of these and able to post a comparison?
I have not skied the Black Crows. I have skied the Vantage series. I feel like the flat Vantages tend to be a little vague, but the system Vantages are super fun and snappy.Anyone ski both of these and able to post a comparison?
Yes, I flexed the 90cti in a shop last weekend and it felt stiff. Thanks for the info!I demoed the Vantage 90cti at Loveland last year IIRC. It was pretty meh. A bit "pingy"? brittle feeling and stiff. Not great balance between the tip and tail. Tip felt somewhat soft and all mountain like but the tail felt stiff. It was just ok. I made two runs and switched it at the demo shop for something else.
Yes, I flexed the 90cti and just by hand flex, it felt stiff. i'm looking for the flex of the 95 in a 90mm ski.
The thing is some skis feel stiff in the store but when skiing they feel great. An example of that is the Head Monster 88. Felt mega stiff in the shop but on the hill it felt great, easy to ski, maneuverable, fun and comfortable since it absorbed the rough stuff. The 90cti felt somewhat stiff in the store but felt stiffer on the hill and not compliant or playful. Just not a good feeling. So that got me thinking that there is a lot more to ski design and the resulting performance than flex and lots of things work together to make or break a ski. Some work well some just dont or are more one dimensional.
Good point. Yes, I've had skis that have felt stiff to flex but have a more refined feel on the snow...and skis that have a soft hand flex but have some oomph on the snow.
My Stockli Stormrider 100's (women's version) are pretty stout, but are so supple that they roll over everything without bouncing me around. The Volkl 90Eight and 100Eight have that "pingy" feel to them (in my opinion)...which is a feeling I want to avoid.
I had a Monster 78 from around 2008......great ski, but a little too damp for my taste. How do the new ones feel by comparison?
So far my experience has been that light, thin skis with carbon are great for the backcountry but in todays overskied resorts they are not good since the slopes get roughed up quickly.
One of factors that I keep in the back of my mind is "If I was on..." After skiing a ski, I think "Boy, if I was on the XXX today would be the perfect day ski day". After I skied any of the Vantages (other than the Vantage X,), I never thought that. I was never out there on any of my ski days and thought "If I was on the Vantage 100, today would be the be the perfect day". Sure they are nice skis, and while I would be contect to ski them if I had to but they are not inspiring. @Ken_R brings up some good points. I have yet to ski the Black Crows and I have heard nothing but good things about them.
The Stocklis at 174 and my ID Ones at 176 (no rocker on these) feel just right.
Will you have them next week when we are in town? If so, bring them to the party.I agree with your philosophy. My ID Ones are inspiriing. My Stockli SR100's are inspiring. (Both of these I bought undemoed after talking at length with reps from both companies).
I had a chance to chat with a Black Crows rep via their website. The Orb is more of hard charger; the Captis is a similar width (90mm) ski that is "rockered" at tip and tail. I put that in quotes because the profile pics I see really look more like twintip, not a rockered ski as I understand it. The Black Crows people call it "double beak." The Captis is more playful, no metal, poppy. That seems a little more like what I'm looking for. I've got a hard charger in the Stockli, and it's magnificent, and I only need one of those.
Now...the length. Size chart says I'm sort of between a 178 and 184. (I'm 178 cm tall, nearly 170 lbs). Backcountry.com rep says the 178; Black Crows rep recommends the 184 for edge length and stability. Go figure.
I have learned that my 170 Volkl Kenjas are too short, hence why I'm replacing them.
The Stocklis at 174 and my ID Ones at 176 (no rocker on these) feel just right. Stocklis "could" be longer but they are burly, so no stability issues at all. They are the fastest skis I've ever been on.
I'm having both lengths sent to my house so I can see and compare. I lose no money by doing so as long as one pair goes back, LOL.
Any suggestions on what to look for/examine when I see them in person?
Correct. I'm actually looking at the Captis instead of the Orb, now (despite the title to this thread...sorry for the confusion).Seems like the 184cm Orbs would have to have an awful lot of rocker to make them your "playful" ski at 8 - 10 cm longer than your "business" skis. For a powder ski that would make sense, but that's not the quiver hole you're filling, right?
I should indeed have them! Good idea!Will you have them next week when we are in town? If so, bring them to the party.
I demoed the Vantage 90cti at Loveland last year IIRC. It was pretty meh. A bit "pingy"? brittle feeling and stiff. Not great balance between the tip and tail. Tip felt somewhat soft and all mountain like but the tail felt stiff. It was just ok. I made two runs and switched it at the demo shop for something else.
I skied both. I concur wiith what Ken-R said about the Atomics. A weird combination of stiffness and lack of stability for me.And vagueness too. Not my cup of tea.
The Orb, on the other hand, is very smooth and stability is great, both on piste and in crud. Edgehold is good, snappyness is... well, they're not the sportiest of skis. But they offer great support and there's no real speed limit. Not that I could find, anyway.
Let's make a deal: we ship some Black Crows from Europe to the US; you send some Renouns back.
I should indeed have them! Good idea!