Transmission issue is stumping mechanics across CO

[SBrown]

So, I thought I'd just throw this out there in case someone has any bright ideas, or even better, experience with this.

My 2004 Land Cruiser, with a little more than 200K on it, has been an absolute rock. As TLCs are. In January, though, I was driving it and all the gear lights came on. First the R lit up, then the P, then ALL the lights, then it fell out of gear. I turned it off, back on, same thing, couldn't put it into gear, assumed my transmission was toast. Towed it to a shop in Leadville (I was in between BV and Salida when it happened), and they called me the next day and said they couldn't find anything wrong with it. It started fine, drove fine, there was a code for the transmission range switch, but it wasn't definitive (or something like that). They weren't sure if the switch was bad or not, but they replaced it because it was the cheapest thing to do, and hey, maybe that was it.

Fast forward to last week. My son has been driving it, mostly around town but a few mountain trips, and one morning in his garage, it wouldn't go into gear. Same thing with the lights, and then the shifter just wouldn't move. He let it sit, tried to start it the next day -- well, it starts just fine ... tried to drive it again, wouldn't work. We brought a code reader over, thinking maybe just clearing the code would help. Nope. So, towed it to our mechanic this time. Naturally, the car worked fine again. (I'm wondering if something about towing it?? Getting it into neutral? is that fixing the issue?)

Anyway, they spent 2 days trying everything they could think of to replicate the issue, taking things apart, testing this that the other, and cannot find a problem. I mean, obviously there is a problem, but it's very intermittent. Any ideas?

 

[Bill Talbot]

So, I thought I'd just throw this out there in case someone has any bright ideas, or even better, experience with this.

My 2004 Land Cruiser, with a little more than 200K on it, has been an absolute rock. As TLCs are. In January, though, I was driving it and all the gear lights came on. First the R lit up, then the P, then ALL the lights, then it fell out of gear. I turned it off, back on, same thing, couldn't put it into gear, assumed my transmission was toast. Towed it to a shop in Leadville (I was in between BV and Salida when it happened), and they called me the next day and said they couldn't find anything wrong with it. It started fine, drove fine, there was a code for the transmission range switch, but it wasn't definitive (or something like that). They weren't sure if the switch was bad or not, but they replaced it because it was the cheapest thing to do, and hey, maybe that was it.

Fast forward to last week. My son has been driving it, mostly around town but a few mountain trips, and one morning in his garage, it wouldn't go into gear. Same thing with the lights, and then the shifter just wouldn't move. He let it sit, tried to start it the next day -- well, it starts just fine ... tried to drive it again, wouldn't work. We brought a code reader over, thinking maybe just clearing the code would help. Nope. So, towed it to our mechanic this time. Naturally, the car worked fine again. (I'm wondering if something about towing it?? Getting it into neutral? is that fixing the issue?)

Anyway, they spent 2 days trying everything they could think of to replicate the issue, taking things apart, testing this that the other, and cannot find a problem. I mean, obviously there is a problem, but it's very intermittent. Any ideas?

I'm assuming this is a computer controlled auto?! What is the fault code being displayed?

Automatic Transmission May Not Shift Correctly at High Mileages
At higher mileages, (125,000-150,000) the automatic transmission may not shift correctly. This can be caused by the throttle position sensor being out of adjustment or a shift solenoid needing to be replaced. Typically the transmission does not need to be completely overhauled.

http://www.autoshop101.com/forms/h17.pdf

http://www.toyotaproblems.com/tsbs/Land_Cruiser/2004/ No TSBS regarding that issue

 

[fatbob]

No help but the thread title tickled me


Buzzfeed worthy


You won't believe what this Landcruiser looks like now!

 

[SBrown]

I'm assuming this is a computer controlled auto?! What is the fault code being displayed?

Automatic Transmission May Not Shift Correctly at High Mileages
At higher mileages, (125,000-150,000) the automatic transmission may not shift correctly. This can be caused by the throttle position sensor being out of adjustment or a shift solenoid needing to be replaced. Typically the transmission does not need to be completely overhauled.

http://www.autoshop101.com/forms/h17.pdf

http://www.toyotaproblems.com/tsbs/Land_Cruiser/2004/ No TSBS regarding that issue

P0705

 

[Bill Talbot]

maybe some hints here..
http://www.ttora.com/forum/157-late-tacoma-tech/124384-tranmission-range-sensor.html

 

[Josh Matta]

Try to find a used Auto Trans ECU.

 

[crgildart]

Had very similar eerie transmission shifting and light phenomenon with my 96 Trooper LS. Dealer diagnosed it as a failing alternator, it was still charging plenty to keep the battery charged, blast loud music, and all the lights we wanted to work, but voltage variances caused the transmission electronics fits. Replaced the alternator.. with an aftermarket which cost less than half what the dealer wanted for Isuzu brand and problem was 100% resolved.

 

[neonorchid]

Timely post!
I have a '07 Toyota which @ 106K miles did something similar! After ~ 6.5 hours on the road 'en-route to Sugarbush VT, it seemingly downshifted while descending a steepish hill, twice, about 5 or 10 minutes apart (two steepish hills). The engine began to rev high, not red line high, downshift high, same high rev up it does if I use the steering column cruise control lever to accelerate. It was fine leaving the hills on the ride from VT back to Philly, the flatlands.
I checked the transmission fluid, it is still red and doesn't smell burnt.
A friend suggested there may be a vacuum line leak.
I called the Toyota dealer where it was purchased new and who did 95% of the minimal service it's required over the years, mostly state inspections. They said that the check engine light is not on it is probably not a vacuum line leak. I was advised to bring it in and have the transmission fluid replaced as routine maintenance, and that the transmission hasn't been wonky again, just drive the car and forget about it. I've yet to bring it in, been too busy, maybe next week. I did ask if it would be ok to drive it from Philly to VT again and they said yes, just keep using the car, should be fine. Again Idk? I could live with replacing it, as after ten years of use doesn't owe me anything but would hate to have to deal with it breaking down hundreds of miles from home.

 

[JeffB]

Those model year LCs still have the manual differential shifter next to the trans shifter, right? If so, the tow company probably shifted it to neutral for the tow, whether flatbed or not, and once at mechanic, put it back in 4H, at which point everything was miraculously fine.

If all that is true, then I would look at the diff sensor which probably runs through the trans range sensor on that truck and, for good measure, double check the vehicle speed sensor as well. Fault in either of those may lead to the code and behavior you're describing.

My general theory I guess is older sensors with some grime and, for whatever reason, shifting the manual diff knob makes the connections clean up a bit and get better until it gets grimed up again and faults.

Since it first happened with you while driving and not parked, I'm guessing it has more to do with the vehicle speed sensor than the trans. We have a 98 with almost 300k and the transmissions in those trucks are bullet proof.

 

[SBrown]

Try to find a used Auto Trans ECU.

He talked about that but since they aren't sure what's what, wasn't ready to go there yet. I already replaced a sensor that probably wasn't bad to begin with.

 

[SBrown]

Those model year LCs still have the manual differential shifter next to the trans shifter, right? If so, the tow company probably shifted it to neutral for the tow, whether flatbed or not, and once at mechanic, put it back in 4H, at which point everything was miraculously fine.

If all that is true, then I would look at the diff sensor which probably runs through the trans range sensor on that truck and, for good measure, double check the vehicle speed sensor as well. Fault in either of those may lead to the code and behavior you're describing.

My general theory I guess is older sensors with some grime and, for whatever reason, shifting the manual diff knob makes the connections clean up a bit and get better until it gets grimed up again and faults.

Since it first happened with you while driving and not parked, I'm guessing it has more to do with the vehicle speed sensor than the trans. We have a 98 with almost 300k and the trans itself in those trucks are bullet proof.

It happened once when driving, once when parked.

But, yeah, I keep thinking about the fact that the tow (flatbed, yes) miraculously fixed it both times. I wasn't there for the second tow, but the first tow, I was the one shifting to neutral, but I did only the transmission, not the manual. At least I don't remember doing that...

I am pretty sure all those related sensors were checked, but I will call back mechanic and get a better list of what all was done.

 

[Josh Matta]

Yeah the thing is i the ECU is bad, the code you are getting could be bad as well.

Its probably going bad its gets hot and the circuits separate a little causing everything to go haywire.

 

[Tony S]

Yeah the thing is i the ECU is bad, the code you are getting could be bad as well.

Its probably going bad its gets hot and the circuits separate a little causing everything to go haywire.

This pretty much covers everything for me the last few years - professional life (software), physiological life, keep going ...

 

[Eleeski]

Replace it with a manual transmission and a clutch.

I've solved a couple weird intermittent problems by disconnecting the battery for a hard reset. I'd sure try that first if it quits on the road. New batteries and alternators help too.

Good luck,
Eric

 

[JeffB]

It happened once when driving, once when parked.

But, yeah, I keep thinking about the fact that the tow (flatbed, yes) miraculously fixed it both times. I wasn't there for the second tow, but the first tow, I was the one shifting to neutral, but I did only the transmission, not the manual. At least I don't remember doing that...

I am pretty sure all those related sensors were checked, but I will call back mechanic and get a better list of what all was done.

If the manual diff knob didn't move but the trans was stuck in park or what it thought was park, then you would have had to use the shift lock release to put it in neutral for the tow. So you would have triggered with the key or a screwdriver the shift lock release under that little plastic door by the shifter. It works with an electric actuator and the actuator could be intermittently malfunctioning. See if mechanics tested that actuator out as well.

Undoubtedly it is one of the electrics that runs through the wiring of the trans position sensor.

 

[mdf]

This pretty much covers everything for me the last few years - professional life (software), physiological life, keep going ...

So, new ECU?

 

[SBrown]

Yeah the thing is i the ECU is bad, the code you are getting could be bad as well.

Its probably going bad its gets hot and the circuits separate a little causing everything to go haywire.

So would other stuff be going wrong, too, then?

 

[SBrown]

Replace it with a manual transmission and a clutch.

I've solved a couple weird intermittent problems by disconnecting the battery for a hard reset. I'd sure try that first if it quits on the road. New batteries and alternators help too.

Good luck,
Eric

Yeah, that was done already, and battery is a-ok.

 

[BGreen]

Have you tried calling Christo Slee (http://sleeoffroad.com/) or posting on ih8mud.com?

 

[SBrown]

Have you tried calling Christo Slee (http://sleeoffroad.com/) or posting on ih8mud.com?

I've read a little on ih8mud but haven't signed up yet to post. And yeah, Slee will be the next stop if I can't get it done "locally." (Yeah, Slee is only 20 min away, but in a perfect world I would stick with my long-time shop down the street.)