Question about AAATTACK 13 demo......

[skijacksonhole]

...I want to get a set of these for a new set of Bonafides, so I can play a little with +/- boot positions on groomer/powder days.

The Bones are/have been 98 under foot forever, and the A13 cutoff on brake width is 97...then bounces up to 115. I'm wondering if that might be a little too wide @ 115. As it seems to be my only option, I guess it'll be OK, but thinking the brakes may catch when carving on PP/on piste. Any one out there have any experience w/this?

 

[Philpug]

The 97mm brake is fine, thats what I use up to 100-102 underfoot.

 

[skijacksonhole]

Thanks, Phil. Makes one wonder why every ski sales guru out there insists that the brake width be at least as wide as the listed waist size. I've never actually measured the width of a brake on a binding, guess I should.

 

[Philpug]

Thanks, Phil. Makes one wonder why every ski guru out there insists that the brake width be at least as wide as the listed waist size. I've never actually measured the width of a brake on a binding, guess I should.

Not every ski guru.

 

[skijacksonhole]

Phil, since you obviously know more about this subject than me, maybe you can answer this....

The A13s accommodate BSL sizes 259-382. I wear a 307. What I'm thinking is, that I may have slightly more play room with where I want to center the boot on the ski, than someone with a larger BSL. The midpoint between 259 and 382 is 322.5, which is larger than my BSL. So, I'm thinking I may be able to go slightly more +/- on the adjustments than someone with a larger boot. Sound logical? Don't think I'll NEED all that range, just wondering if my thinking process is correct.

I'm getting conflicting information on the new A13 brake width....some sites say 97, 115....others say 95, 110. I went to the Tyrolia site and they say 95, 110, but I think they're talking about last year's model.

***update...just phoned someone who sells a lot of these bindings...apparently Tyrolia did change the listed brake width, but they're the same width as previous models - and, much like Phil said earlier, the guy told me the 95 or 97 will fit everything just fine up to a 105 waist width without any adjustment of the brake arms.

 

[Philpug]

Phil, since you obviously know more about this subject than me, maybe you can answer this....

The A13s accommodate BSL sizes 259-382. I wear a 307. What I'm thinking is, that I may have slightly more play room with where I want to center the boot on the ski, than someone with a larger BSL. The midpoint between 259 and 382 is 322.5, which is larger than my BSL. So, I'm thinking I may be able to go slightly more +/- on the adjustments than someone with a larger boot. Sound logical? Don't think I'll NEED all that range, just wondering if my thinking process is correct.

I'm getting conflicting information on the new A13 brake width....some sites say 97, 115....others say 95, 110. I went to the Tyrolia site and they say 95, 110, but I think they're talking about last year's model.

First, I have skied and owned every incarnation of the Bonafide including next years all new design. With that said, the mount point is dead on, no need to worry about moving fore or aft. Second, the brake width, I don't care what the numbers say the 9Xmm brake will work on the Bonafide. Third, just get a regular Attack 13, mount it, set it and forget it. You will be good to go.

 

[skijacksonhole]

I like when someone is adamant . Thanks, Phil.

 

[Monique]

Thanks, Phil. Makes one wonder why every ski sales guru out there insists that the brake width be at least as wide as the listed waist size. I've never actually measured the width of a brake on a binding, guess I should.

I've never heard this. Always the opposite, that you don't want it to be significantly wider than your ski, because you can always bend the brake out, but you don't want to bend in - and a wider brake means greater chance of the brakes getting hooked on something.

 

[markojp]

Phil is spot on. Don't overthink this.

 

[skijacksonhole]

Back on the 2018 Bones today but w/ a twist. As many of you may know mine are mounted w/ Marker Schizos. Today I moved them fwd +1 cm........... all I can say is ........... they are staying there from now on! I use them for east coast hardpack up to @4-5" new (after that it's up to my 110's underfoot). WOW these skis woke up! They've gone from "Tool" to "Weapon"! Move them fwd for a nice surprise just be prepared for the fun factor to jump off the charts. Mine are 180 in length and I'm 215 lbs. Today's conditions eastern mank, packed pow, dust on crust....... These were my "Work" skis............ they are now my "FUN" skis............ The words that usually come to mind when describing the Bones w/ their two layers of metal are.......... Expert, Work, Hard Charging, Intense, Heavy, Versatile, Demanding............. etc...... Now I place FUN squarely and firmly at the top of that list after today's experiment. Holy CRAP what a ski! Blizzard NAILED this one! Good Job and Schizo's Rule.......... Changed the feel and turning speed of this ski and totally ramped up the fun w/ a few turns of a phillips head driver. Okay I need to go calm down!........ What a RUSH!

Phil is spot on. Don't overthink this.

I don't want to overthink it, but replies such as the one above make me think that I've been potentially missing the sweet spot on occasion all these years. The poster above is heavier and taller than me, and has skied previous Bonafides....the benefit he derived by moving his Schizos up 10mm seems to have impressed him with the 2017-18 model Bonafide. I do have a wider powder ski I use for deep days, but most of my skiing has been done on a Bonafide or something similar in waist. My only reason for considering a demo binding would be to move forward a cm on crud/warm/coral reef type days, and see how that feels. Because of what Phil said, though, I don't know if I'd really feel an appreciable difference - but some folks obviously do.

 

[Yo Momma]

After re-reading my original post I've gone back and forth skiing the old original Bones ( mounted at boot center marking ) and back to the 2018's @10mm fwd. I still LOVE my original Bones. It was like getting re-acquainted w/ an old friend. I was intimately familiar w/ how they would respond and loved them just as much as ever........... but man they are WORK........... they do it all........but you feel it. The 2018's .........just fun........... fun turns, fun jumps, fun bumps, fun everything. Other than for experimentation purposes they are staying fwd for now.

 

[skijacksonhole]

After re-reading my original post I've gone back and forth skiing the old original Bones ( mounted at boot center marking ) and back to the 2018's @10mm fwd. I still LOVE my original Bones. It was like getting re-acquainted w/ an old friend. I was intimately familiar w/ how they would respond and loved them just as much as ever........... but man they are WORK........... they do it all........but you feel it. The 2018's .........just fun........... fun turns, fun jumps, fun bumps, fun everything. Other than for experimentation purposes they are staying fwd for now.

Thanks for your good input. I have been skiing the old Bonafides (180) as well as some Salomons and K2s, but I'm ready for a new set of daily skis, and it's looking like the new Bonafides are going to be coming my way. I've always mounted all my skis on the line, but lately have been thinking I wouldn't mind the option of moving my boot forward or backward, as you have done. The fact that you're a bigger guy than me (5' 9.5", 165) and still derive some measurable benefit going forward on the 180 mount hasn't been lost on me. I have about 7 months to figure out what bindings to get....hope that's enough time! LOL

 

[DanoT]

skijacksonhole, something else that you might want to consider is the performance difference between the Attack13 demo and Attack13 rec binding and how they are mounted to the ski.

For 2016-17 the demo toe plate is attached with 2 pairs of screws about 5" apart. When the ski is flexed there then is about 5" of "flat spot" under the toe plate where the ski will not flex evenly. With the recreational binding a pair of screws attach the toe piece to the ski and then a second pair of screws attaches a plastic clip to the ski that sort of hooks on to the toe piece but performs like a hinge when the ski is flexed, allowing a more even flex.

Myself, being a bit of a flail-er, I know I wouldn't notice a difference, but a more precise technical skier might.

 

[skijacksonhole]

Thanks, Dano...there's no doubt that demo bindings have improved over the years, but still no substitute for a regular binding. As Phil has said, I'm probably over-thinking this. I did look at the Schizo as another alternative, but I like the flexibility of a demo, if I were to go with an adjustable binding, vs. the Schizo or another like-type adjustable. A friend could use my skis with a demo, if anyone would ever come to visit me in the Hole in winter - not an attractive proposition for many of my warm-weather buds. If only they knew....